About nothing

[Black Bart]

(as George Costanza would say); that's what this post is. A bit slow around here today, isn't it? What to discuss?

What about food? I bought a Subway "$5 foot-long" today, but I'm old enough that five-dollar sandwiches don't seem like much of a bargain to me (not to mention the $1.55 Dr. Pepper).

It was kind of a depressing day today, but the girl-clerk's big smile at McDonald's drive-through window brightened up my morning considerably -- they're really good at that (even if the order's wrong 50% of the time).

P.S. A tax angle -- anybody got cafe clients? The ones I see are, without exception, terrible record-keepers and I occasionally have to just stop doin' their taxes (sales/payroll/income) because they won't even bother to put a face on it.

[BHoffman]

Experience vs. Academia

...since we are talking about nothing...something I'm good at

Watching the debates made me think about an accountant who has taken all of the required courses, passed all the final exams with flying colors, graduated at the top of all of the class, passed all sections of the CPA exam, satisfied all requirements for licensure, taught classes as a grad student, obtained an MBA, and is now standing there bright and shiny with all of the answers.

What a vast difference there is between theory and practice in our profession! How much hands-on experience must a fledgling preparer have before he or she will achieve even a bare minimum level of adequacy in actually preparing good tax returns? How much of our work involves professional judgement that no amount of academic training can give us? How many of our decisions and how much of our advice affects the financial well being of our clients? Do we base our decisions and advice on stuff we learned in school, or stuff we learned from experience? How many times have you found the how-to answer dealing with an unfamiliar tax situation in the IRC or the forum or elsewhere and then froze up when it comes to actually preparing the return? I understand form 3115 (for instance), but am going to feel pretty darn unsure of myself filling one out for the first time. I understand Sec 179 depreciation recapture, but (ashamed to admit this) never feel absolutely confident that I'm calculating it correctly.

Who would you rather have prepare your own taxes, if you weren't able or willing to do it yourself? The bright and shiny college grad with lots of fancy talk and no experience, or the old curmudgeon who has been in the trenches preparing taxes for the last 25 years?

This is what I thought about after watching the debate.

[Snaggletooth]

Old Curmudgeon

the old curmudgeon who has been in the trenches preparing taxes for the last 25 years?

I've been looking for a good way to describe myself, and Ms. Hoffman has just stumbled upon it.

They don't teach human nature at any of those places. Maybe they should, but if they did, the teachers would get fired. You learn it, after dealing with the public a long time. In fact, in many cases what they teach is diametrically opposite of what to expect from the public.

The public is basically us, and responds most dramatically based on whose ox is being gored. They are no better or worse than the nature within us.

Impeccably trained accountant: "Does your company conform to the rules of §754(a)?"
Client: "Dunno."

What they will never teach impeccable: Most people are more occupied with lower taxes than the fine science of proper reporting and will prefer a preparer occupied with the same agenda. They gravitate to people who speak their language, not stilted like the King's court. Most are honest when convenient, a precious few are honest beyond convenient, and a few are not honest at any opportunity. Mr. Impeccable had best learn human nature when operating outside an academic environment, and learn to read his clientele in every possible way, from eye contact to body language.

Let's give Mr. Impeccable his due reward. The combination of adequate knowledge, personal care, and integrity is something we should all strive for.

"If you can walk with Kings, and keep the common touch" - Rudyard Kipling

[erchess]

Experience Vs Academics

I have the BA (cum laude with honors in History) from one University, the Master of Divinity (without distinction) from another, and coursework without degrees or awards beyond in some cases CEUS from two Universities and three Technical Community Colleges but the sum total from all that work that related in any way to what I do for a living now was two semesters of Accounting. I have worked in the fields of religion, manufacturing, tourism, farming, construction, and education. I have logged over the years probably 500 hours of course work through my former employer, a storefront firm, and probably another 200 or so of coursework through providers of CEUs. I have been in the tax business since 1993 and every off-season save three has seen me expand the realm of returns I could take on without assistance. One of the three was the year I passed the SEE. I cluttered my head with trivia about entity returns, none of which I had ever done. I also learned to calculate sale of home results under then current law in my head but that was all I needed to learn about the individual returns with which I was comfortable in order to pass the SEE. The other two years were years when I wanted to keep up my credential but thought I might be getting out of this business and into MLM. I recovered my sanity and returned to this business. I would have to say that out of it all the most valuable training I received was my undergraduate, where I learned that I can read and understand anything I put my mind to and where I learned to distinguish between what I know and what I do not know. The next most valuable thing I learned came from my work history. I know how to read people and I know what sorts of income and expenses are common in a wide variety of professions.

There B is an emoticon and I will try to remember that you like me to use them. I don't think there is a Bull Emoticon though.

[BHoffman]

Nice curriculum vitae, erchess.

Now if we can just get you to use the smilies.....