Stumped On Annuity

[SueBaby]

Client has Statement of Annuity Paid not a 1099-R. Just gross amount and the fed withheld. How can I find out the taxable amount? Always gets a 1099-R and not this.

[LawrenceGR]

Maybe

it's Federal gov't pension, those are reportrd on a CSF-1099-R. I have one of those they only show gross, fed tax and amount for Ins.

[SueBaby]

it's Federal gov't pension, those are reportrd on a CSF-1099-R. I have one of those they only show gross, fed tax and amount for Ins.

I have Drake and I don't find a CSF 1099-R. So now what to do?

[ChEAr$]

It's still a 1099R form,

I have Drake and I don't find a CSF 1099-R. So now what to do?

no matter what software you use. However......

Who is the payor? And why isn't there a 1099R form OR acceptable substitute therefor?
Perhaps client is mixed up and didn't recognzie the 1099R when it came in the mail.

Now if it's a civil sevice 1099R, and the client is really, really old, and retired 20 years ago,
then it's all taxable. But if he retired sometime before about.... oh... 4 years ago, then
it's up to him/you to figure out the taxable amount from his records. See publication 721
for details.

[SueBaby]

no matter what software you use. However......

Who is the payor? And why isn't there a 1099R form OR acceptable substitute therefor?
Perhaps client is mixed up and didn't recognzie the 1099R when it came in the mail.

Now if it's a civil sevice 1099R, and the client is really, really old, and retired 20 years ago,
then it's all taxable. But if he retired sometime before about.... oh... 4 years ago, then
it's up to him/you to figure out the taxable amount from his records. See publication 721
for details.

That is just it. He has this done in Ca. and don't know nothing about it and I called the IRS and said what method to use last year I have to this year. So what method and how to use it is my question. I did put it on the 1099-R but what is taxable I dont't know.

He retired in 1993 and born in 1935 and it is from Office of Personnel Management Retirement Services Program that is all I know.

[SueBaby]

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Excuse me? Maybe you can answer does it matter on what method I use on the general rule method or the worksheet way since we don't know which to use this year.

[thomtax]

What method was used on the 2006 return?

LT

[ecb34691]

To set the record straight on Civil Service Retirement. A CSA1009R is issued to a retired federal employee and shows Federal Tax withheld, Gross annuity amount, state taxes withheld, Health Insurance premiums, Original contributions, taxable amount, distribution code and claim number. A CSF1099R is issued to a survior benefit of a civil service person (active or retired). If they retired before 1986, they use the general rule on taxability (and it is all now taxable). If they retired after 1986, use the simpiled method to determine the taxable amount, that is why the original contributions are on the form.

OPM tried a couple of years ago to include the taxable amount on the form and "screwed up" so bad they had to re-issue about 800,000 of them.

Been there, done it and know. - Proudly retired US Treasury with 30 years of service.

[SueBaby]

What method was used on the 2006 return?

LT

2006 was done in Ca and I don't know who done it to ask.

[SueBaby]

To set the record straight on Civil Service Retirement. A CSA1009R is issued to a retired federal employee and shows Federal Tax withheld, Gross annuity amount, state taxes withheld, Health Insurance premiums, Original contributions, taxable amount, distribution code and claim number. A CSF1099R is issued to a survior benefit of a civil service person (active or retired). If they retired before 1986, they use the general rule on taxability (and it is all now taxable). If they retired after 1986, use the simpiled method to determine the taxable amount, that is why the original contributions are on the form.

OPM tried a couple of years ago to include the taxable amount on the form and "screwed up" so bad they had to re-issue about 800,000 of them.

Been there, done it and know. - Proudly retired US Treasury with 30 years of service.

Thank you for your information on this. I don't know what he done last year and I was going to do this method anyway. Thanks for your confidence in doing this RIGHT! Appreciate it very much have a good day.

[ChEAr$]

retired in 1993 from US government ?

Then he is in process of recovering costs under the simplied rule. You know, pension cost
divided by number of months proscribed in the regulations?

[Roland Slugg]

Employee annuities

Dear SueBaby

I suggest you read about "employee annuities" in any tax handbook, such as CCH's or RIA's. There are separate rules for calculating the excludable portion, depending on the year of retirement and, in some cases, whether the annuity is paid over the life of a single payee or two payees.

Use your software's 1099-R screen for entering everything. There should be a separate section (or perhaps a separate screen) for entering pension and annuity distributions using the "simplified method."

[SueBaby]

Dear SueBaby

I suggest you read about "employee annuities" in any tax handbook, such as CCH's or RIA's. There are separate rules for calculating the excludable portion, depending on the year of retirement and, in some cases, whether the annuity is paid over the life of a single payee or two payees.

Use your software's 1099-R screen for entering everything. There should be a separate section (or perhaps a separate screen) for entering pension and annuity distributions using the "simplified method."

Thanks to all<><>this has been a toughy.

[ecb34691]

Sue Baby, send me a private e-mail on this board and I will give you the answers. OPM is simply, no complicated rules, we all contributed 7.5% of our salary to the US retirement fund, hence the figure of original contributions. Employees hired after 1984 are under a different system called FERS in which they contribute less but also pay FICA.

Added - Check IRS Pub 721 Tax Guide to U.S. Civil Service Retirement Benefits

[David1980]

OPM tool

OPM has a calculator on their website to determine the tax free portion of the annuity payment actually.

http://apps.opm.gov/tax_calc/index.cfm

Play with the calc, if nothing else it will give you the right questions to ask of the taxpayer.