I Hate Dependent Laws

[BOB W]

Although this is not new here is a client's situation:

Unmarried TPs(boyfriend/girl friend) have a child. They live in his house (homeowner) for 8 month. Girl friend moves back with her mother in beginning of September. He makes 90,000 and girlfriend approx 11,000. Baby stays with Girlfriend. Girlfriend is at boyfriends house 4 or 5 days a week, sometimes with baby and sometimes without.

How should the boyfriend file>>Single, HOH without baby, HOH with baby, or what.

Girlfriend may want to file HOH with baby, I don't know yet. On her low income she would have a hard time qualifying for HOH in any case. Boyfriend gave all support whether in his home or at girlfriend's mother's house (200 per week while at mother's house).

Help????????????????????

[Brian EA]

Both file single. If girl friend claims the kid she will get the EIC.
Boy friend will probaly benefit more if he claims the kid. He will get the Child tax credit and based on his tax rate will come out better at the end.
Work it both ways, Bob.

brian

[BOB W]

I would like the Boyfriend to get HOH with or without claiming child. Is that posible?

[joanmcq]

It sounds like he could; he provided more than half the cost of a home for HIS child for the year. It sounds like GF cannot be HOH because now she is living with her mother and did not provide more than half the cost of keeping a household for the child for the year.

[BOB W]

It sounds like he could; he provided more than half the cost of a home for HIS child for the year. It sounds like GF cannot be HOH because now she is living with her mother and did not provide more than half the cost of keeping a household for the child for the year.

The more I read TTB the clearer the mud gets. It seems like he should also get the dependency of the child based on support but I'm not sure about custody. There is no agreement and the child goes where the mother goes. Am I understanding the custody issue correctly when it is single people?

[erchess]

I don't see how he can claim the child

as a dependent without her permission. She might want to give that permission since I think he can get a lot more for the child than she can. Can't she get EIC while he gets the exemption and the child tax credit?

This sounds to me like one of those cases where I cheerfully get someone more than they would get if I wrote the tax laws. As I see it my job is to help each taxpayer who asks for my help get the best deal allowed by the law and the facts. If I cannot or will not do that then I need to pass on their business. I don't personally think anyone should get any tax or other benefits for a child born out of wedlock. And in particular the fathers should not get benefits. But that is just my peculiarity and I have no right to impose it on anyone else.

[Jesse]

Wouldn't custody then be determined by who physically had the child in their care for the greatest time? If they can't determine that then tie breaker goes to highest AGI.

I don't see how they can split the EIC and CTC/Dependency deduction and it seems no matter who takes the child Mom is Single.

[Lion]

Who Is Your Client?

Who's your client? If both AND they want the most money in their combined situation, then run the numbers all ways. If both but they want the biggest refund to go to the mother (to reimburse grandma for living expense, maybe) or some other outcome, then you find the best outcome for THEIR needs. If one of them is your client, then you find the best outcome for YOUR client.

[erchess]

Wouldn't custody then be determined by who physically had the child in their care for the greatest time? If they can't determine that then tie breaker goes to highest AGI.

I don't see how they can split the EIC and CTC/Dependency deduction and it seems no matter who takes the child Mom is Single.

It was stated in the original post that the child was always living with Mom, who lived eight months with Dad and four months with Gramma. However the law allows mother to give the dependency exemption to the Father at her discretion. I think she could even give the exemption to you or me if so inclined. You are also incorrect in thinking that they can't split EIC and CTC/Dependency. Nowhere in the EIC rules is it written that you have to be able to claim the child's exemption. It is also btw possible for Dad to get HOH out of the child whether or not he gets her dependency exemption.

You are correct that mother is Single.

In reference to what Lion said, my approach as TP would depend on whether I was working for Mom, Dad, or both. If I were working for both I would have to explain that they have a conflict of interest because they can't both get the maximum benefit.

[Gretel]

I think dad has same right to claim child as mom has. Both are the parents but since they were never married mom doesn't need to give permission. Tie braker rules will apply though, which would give child to mom. Let's hope they can agree.

Bob, I, too hate the dependency rules. Since they changed them I keep getting confused all over again in certain situations.

[erchess]

The reason he can't claim the child without Mom's

permission is that there was no time when child lived with him and not mother and child was with mother the whole year. It's therefore clear that she has physical custody of the child for the whole year. That means the dependency exemption goes where she says it does and any money Dad brings to the situation affects dependency only to the extent Mom says it does.

[Jesse]

I too get the rules mixed up - I was not taking into account the support issue. W/ divorced couples the child support is considered as provided by both parents.

In your case has Dad provided more than 1/2 the support for the year? Child lived w/ Dad for more than 1/2 the year so this then would be Dad's qualifying child.

[Jesse]

It was stated in the original post that the child was always living with Mom, who lived eight months with Dad and four months with Gramma. However the law allows mother to give the dependency exemption to the Father at her discretion. I think she could even give the exemption to you or me if so inclined. You are also incorrect in thinking that they can't split EIC and CTC/Dependency. Nowhere in the EIC rules is it written that you have to be able to claim the child's exemption. It is also btw possible for Dad to get HOH out of the child whether or not he gets her dependency exemption.

You are correct that mother is Single.

In reference to what Lion said, my approach as TP would depend on whether I was working for Mom, Dad, or both. If I were working for both I would have to explain that they have a conflict of interest because they can't both get the maximum benefit.

The custodial parent can let the noncustodial parent take the dependency and child tax credit but if both qualify to take the child you cannot split the credits. And by no means can someone just give to you or me any exemption just because they are so inclined.

[BP.]

And by no means can someone just give to you or me any exemption just because they are so inclined.

Absolutely agree with that.

And what about TTB p. 3-17- QC of More Than One Person. The child only has to be member of household for more than half the year to be a taxpayer's QC. This child meets the test for both parents. Also see Pub 17, p. 28.

[BOB W]

So, this is what I plan on doing.. Mom (child's mother) says she is taking the child as dependent. I do not do Mom's (child's mother's) tax return. Father will claim HOH with no dependency and list childs name and SS on line 4. And that is that. Child's mother can do what she want> not my client.


Thank you all for guiding me through this maze of Congressional overgrown fodder.