self prepared return/efile question

[POCAHONTAS]

I had a person ask me to electronically file their return which he had prepared himself. I have never been approached to do that before so the question is:- Is that permitted by the IRS? And has anyone had a similar situation?

[wv112]

You will spend as much time keying his return in order to efile as if you prepared it. You might want to think twice before you start doing this.

[BOB W]

Just give him your normal fee + $25. the $25 is for the setup time you will never recover next year when he doesn't back.

[WhiteOleander]

The bad part about this is, if there is something wrong on the return (and there almost always is) you cannot send it. You tell them something is wrong. They ask you what is wrong and how to fix it. Then, you either tell them free or change it to you as preparer with your fee.

They don't want to pay your fee. But they want you to tell them free how to fix it.

No win situation.

BTDT

[erchess]

My Advice

is to find out whether you have to do these people and what the latest rules are concerning your fees for them versus your regular fees. There could be laws in your State or IRS Policies. I don't believe that NC or the IRS require me to do these clients and since I went out on my own no one has asked me to, but I actually would.

If you don't have to do them, one question would be what sort of software you use, be it Forms Entry where your screen has a picture of the Form or Spreadsheet Entry where your screen has a picture of a spreadsheet. I have the former although in making most entries on a return I prepare, I go "behind" the form to some other screen or screens to record more detail than is possible on a paper form. But if I had a a return I didn't prepare I would tick the relevant box so I would remember that and I would enter the return exactly as it appeared. I would charge half the fee I would charge for preparing the same return. If the return did not pass diagnostics and I did not see fit to or could not override them, and the problem was not my keying nor my software insisting on additional information, I would fix it only for more money. It's all about getting paid a fair wage for the work I take on versus the fact that I for marketing purposes let clients go away scott free if they are unhappy at the end of the process, so I am motivated to try to find a fee that we can both live with. .

[thomtax]

Also, be sure to check the box, or whatever your software requires, so that it does not show you as the preparer. I think much of the software automatically shows you as the preparer unless you override it. If it shows you as the preparer, you could have unwanted problems if something goes wrong.

LT

[POCAHONTAS]

Also, be sure to check the box, or whatever your software requires, so that it does not show you as the preparer. I think much of the software automatically shows you as the preparer unless you override it. If it shows you as the preparer, you could have unwanted problems if something goes wrong.

LT

Well I was able to put self prepared on the return but it asks for my PTIN number in order for me to E-file. So does that mean that it could still cause problems because I have to put in my PTIN.
Thank you so much for your help

[taxmandan]

Check that your software isn't putting your companies information in as well as the preparer info. My software requires that the company info be blank and that 'NONE' is entered into the preparer info block to show it was self-prepared. It should not need your PTIN to efile, just the ERO information for the 8879.

[Snaggletooth]

Software Blocks It

Pocahontas, you'd best tell this freeloader you'll prepare and e-file his return and charge him accordingly. Plus, there is something wrong with his return or he would have been able to e-file it himsef.

Your software is already balking at all of the buckets you've filled up with your name, EFIN, P-number, etc. and then trying to claim this return is "self-prepared."

[JohnH]

Charge more

I don't efile, but when someone asks me to "grade their paper" I always tell them it will cost more than if I simply prepare the return.

When they ask why, I explain to them that I can take their info, prepare the return correctly, and charge for my time. Or I can take their return and correct the errors in about the same amount of time. But then I'll have to spend more time explaining why their self-prepared return is wrong, probably line-by-line. Plus I'll have to expalin all their misconceptions about the tax law. More time equals more cost.

Believe me, for every self-prepared return you are able to simply input into your system, there will be two more that will soak up much more time than you would spend simply doing the preparation. I'm with those who say pass on this opportunity - you're not talking to a long-term prospect,

[Fuzzy Faced Leader]

There are a few ethical problems here. The revised Circular 230 implies that if you charge a fee, you are a paid provider and have to sign the return. Even unsigned preparers are subject to penalties. I have a client that loves to prepare his return on TurboTax, then brings it to me. I have to completely re-do the return, because it is so screwed up. I tell him every year that it costs more this way. In your case, I question how the taxpayer could have the intelligence to prepare the return, yet not have the intelligence to e-file it. I think all software packages have the ability to e-file. This sounds like he wants a professional to e-file it, to give the return credibility. I would tell him: 1) to go to HRB or 2) go to the IRS website and use free E-file or 3) that the return will be totally scrutinized, and all items need to be supported, and it will cost him $ 1,000.00, to cover the cost of potential penalties.

Keith

[ChEAr$]

self prepared returns

AT first, back in 1989, I did this as a community service, since I was the first and only ERO in
the area. And it added to the bottom line.

But as I found out over several years, it just ain't worth it. Period.

You can't efile a return with errors that cause rejects, and that causes you to have to call
the ... (not client... ) perpetrator! and give return back to him for him to correct before you
can send it again. So if he used wrong line for EIC, it's a reject, or at least when your software figures it right, the form he signed is all wrong.

Finally I stopped and told people I would be the preparer and charge accordingly.

That''ll be six cents, please! (used to be 2 cents, but.. inflation, you know.)

[dmj4]

Agree

Fifteen years ago we had quite a few people that did prepare their own return and then wanted us to just efile. I did do it. They were all hand written and most did have mistakes or problems. It did take more time to explain to them why it was wrong. As I got busier I began just telling them straight that I had to redo the return to get it into my computer to efile it, so I would have to charge the full price. They did agree to it because they did want it efiled. If they didn't ask too many questions and the return was correct I would charge the low end. If they wanted to pick my brain for every tax sitution they had ever encountered or were likely to encounter in a lifetime, I would go the high end of the fee schedule.
dmj4

[S T]

I wouldn't

For me, I would not do an efile for self prepared return. All or nothing!Sandy

As mentioned above, these clients have the ability to file their returns on line through various different sources.

Why are they approaching you to efile their self prepared return, you do have to enter the information, and sign yourself as ERO to it? That seems to me to be a lot of work and exposure. It is like preparing the tax return from "scratch" only difference is that you are using the client figures rather than asking all of the questions.

I don't think so!

Sandy

[taxea]

self prepared return/efile question

I tell the client that the fee for reviewing the return is $50. up front. Ifthere is an error I cannot file the return. He will be notified of any errors but not what they are or how to correct them. If he wants me to redo the return the fee is my regular tax prep fee.
If there are no errors the return is efiled as a non-paid preparer return and there is no additional fee. taxea