Tax Prep Software

[Kurly]

Hey folks do any of you know what the software is that these used car dealers and check cashing outlets use to prepare their clients tax return so that they can have access to their refund for a checking account loan or down payment on an auto?

Thanks

K

[Frank - VA]

Many of them use Crosslink from Petz Enterprises. I was hired by an 18 office check cashing firm to manage their tax operations. They used Crosslink and it wasn't too bad. I can't say the same for the check cashing firm. I tried for 2 months to get them to fall into line with IRS guidelines before I had no choice but to tell them goodbye. I do know that other similar firms use Creosslink as well.

[Black Bart]

Car lots

Kurly / Didn't have any idea what they used, but had often wondered.

Frank / Do all the car lots hire a tax professional (I'm assuming you are one)?

[Frank/VA]

No, I was the only tax professional for 18 offices. Most of the other districts of this 400+ office chain had NO tax pro and were constantly calling me. Not that it mattered. They were doing so much illegal stuff, I quit around 1/15 befor I got into trouble. I figured the NON tax pros might get off with a wrist slap, but I was supposed to know what I was doing. You wouldn't believe the way these people do business.

[JWCPA]

RALs anyone?

There's a lot of controversy in the industry about whether it's ethical for tax professionals to do RALs. Those who are opposed say it's not in the best interest of the client and the tax preparer is not looking out for the best interest of the client, the interest is exhorbitant, and welfare money is going into the pockets of tax preparers and bankers.

Those in favor say there is a demand for RALs, and if they don't provide RALs, someone down the street will provide them, and they have to in order to remain competitive.

I doubt there is a tax professional out there who thinks it's a good idea for car dealers to prepare tax returns in order to take refunds as down payments, esepecially when those dealers don't know anything at all about tax preparation. But here we have our slippery slope.

Anyone who condones RALs needs to be careful about criticizing car dealers who prepare tax returns. After all, "everybody does it," there is a demand for it, and if this car dealer doesn't do it, the car dealer down the street will. Exactly the same arguments as to why it's O.K. for tax professionals to provide RALs.

[Roberts]

The problem would be whether the car dealership really has the client's best interest at heart. If they get a refund that is larger than the client is due, knowing that by the time the IRS catches it and requests the money back that the car will have already been sold and the commission earned.

[JWCPA]

The problem would be whether the car dealership really has the client's best interest at heart. If they get a refund that is larger than the client is due, knowing that by the time the IRS catches it and requests the money back that the car will have already been sold and the commission earned.

I don't think the car dealers have the customers best interests at heart. I think they are doing it for the money.

I also do not believe that tax professionals have their clients best interests at heart when they do RALs. I think they're doing it for the money.

I don't see much difference.

[JWCPA]

I went to the doctor the other day because I'm overweight and it's affecting my health. The doctor knew that the best thing for my health was to convince me to eat right and exercise and have regular checkups. It wouldn't be the easiest thing for me to do but it would be the best thing for my health.

Instead doc pulled out his prescription tablet and prescribed amphetamines. He knew it wasn't the best thing for my health but the doctor down the road prescribes these things, I'll take a few and feel great for a couple of weeks, I'll lose weight, and I'll think those little pills are wonderful. And he'll make more money because he doesn't have to waste time on monitoring and followup appointments, which pay less in insurance money. I'll be happy and think he did me a favor, and he'll make more money. If he didn't give me those little white pills somebody else would have.

I won't be as healthy, but that's not what it's about. Too bad for me if I was looking for a doctor who would make decisions based on what was in my best interests health wise.

[retailguy]

I agree in principle except for one thing

I don't think the car dealers have the customers best interests at heart. I think they are doing it for the money.

I also do not believe that tax professionals have their clients best interests at heart when they do RALs. I think they're doing it for the money.

I don't see much difference.

Well, you missed one thing. We are preparing (hopefully) LEGAL returns where the client is due a refund, then we are offering a legal product that gets them money about 10 days quicker. Believe me, I explain the difference in cost and the effective interest rate, but you cannot make people think. You just cannot. The choice you make as a preparer is do you turn away the business, or do you prepare the return? Maybe one day, I'll have enough business to say "It doesn't matter". I'm just not there today.

[Frank/VA]

While I am not a big fan of RAL's, I do offer them (but don't promote them) in my current business.

My issues with the check cashing firm had nothing to do with the morality or immorality of offering RAL's. That is an ongoing disucssion that one could argue forever and never win on either side. My concerns were with issues that were non-debatably illegal methods of operation. At least they would have been non-debatable to the posters on this board and with most tax-pros at large.

For example: We know that we must sign the tax returns as "preparer". They refused to allow that, saying we were only ERO's. This was in spite of the fact that the return was prepared based solely on a 4 page questionaire created by the check cashing firm. That is no different than you or I sitting down and asking the questions face to face as preparers. They had just reduced the most common questions to paper. Note they reduced the "MOST COMMON QUESTIONS" to paper. The actual preparer never saw the client face to face and completed the return solely based on what was on that piece of paper. How accurate could that have been?

Further, the description of filing statuses on the questionnaire was so incomplete that it would easily have misled many people to claim HOH who were not qualified for that status. Not that many of them needed a whole lot of incentive to make that claim.

Another example: We know that the client should only sign an 8453 AFTER the return has been completed. They required the client to sign a blank 8453 BEFORE the preparation was begun at the time when the questionnaire was completed. Then they e-filed the return and got the bank loan approved and the check cut before the client ever saw what was on the 8453 or any other part of the tax return. He had only seen the 4 page questionnaire.

I could go on and on but there are some good examples of why I had to resign before the tax season began.

Note that this was being done in about 450 offices of this company nationwide and I was led to believe that it was the norm in the check cashing business.

Further note that they not only got the fees for the e-filing and a separate fee for the tax preparation, they also then got the outrageous fee for cashing the RAL check, a check that they knew was good and on which they took no risk becasuie they had actually cut the check themselves based on a tax return they had prepared themselves.

[Kurly]

Check Cash Store

Hey Frank do happen to have a copy of that 4 page questionaire?

If so can u e-mail it to me @ 9grand@comcast.net

Thanks

K

[Frank/VA]

Sorry. I do not have the questionnaire. That was 5 years ago and I didn't keep anything from there except for my e-mail correspondence with their management. I only kept that to protect myself in the event anything ever came down about my involvement with them.

[Frank/VA]

It just occurred to me to wonder why you would want that questionnaire?

[Safire]

Sounds like you made a wise decision in resigning that position Frank.