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    Fast Tax Experience

    Well folks, it had to happen sooner or later. I am between jobs with nothing
    going on except my 120 tax clients. A friend of mine runs a fast refund tax
    place, and had one of his people quit, so I offered to come help him for a
    couple weeks during the heat of the season. It was a real fire drill.

    I've heard all the horror stories from the earned income crowd, and had the
    opportunity to see just how bad it was. A 350 lb. woman came in and said
    she cleaned houses for a living. No W-2, no 1099, but claimed she cleaned
    4 houses a week for $50 per house. A daughter she claimed lived with her
    meant [poof!!] a $2500 refund. Dropped her handbag and she couldn't bend
    over to pick it up. But she cleans houses for a living. Also I was amazed
    at the large number of customers who had no bank accounts.

    Even with me helping, the office was swamped. The IRS had shut down
    another fast tax place in town for undisclosed reasons, and my friend was
    getting the overflow. One customer came in to get her taxes done, and said
    she had worked at the other place before they shut it down. My friend hired
    her on the spot, after filling out her taxes. I kid you not.

    I found out quickly about my friend's expertise. He knew more than any of
    his crew, but he knew more about e-filing and bank products than anything
    else. Overall, a decent guy and not a crook. I brought him "grey area" decisions
    to make since these were his customers. Most of the time he was easier
    than myself, but not always.

    The "fast tax" option was with a bank I never heard of, and to be honest
    with you, the fees were reasonable. A flat $35 plus about 54% interest. This
    may sound high, but the total fee was about 1/3 of what was being charged
    by HRB in most cases. Charges never ran over $220 even including the
    preparers' fee. If all RALs were this reasonable, I would not be so adamant
    against them.

    One of the other experienced preparers attempted to coax customers into
    claiming enough income to reach some $15,000 where EIC is maximized.
    I had a real problem with that. I would estimate some 50% of these people
    were lying about either their marital status or children, or maybe both. One
    woman brought in six social security cards with five different last names,
    all of them supposedly her own children. Supporting all of them as head
    of household on a $9000 W-2.

    There was a huge number of amended returns, and he wanted me to do all
    of them because I knew more about them. People would come in and
    somehow "forget" they worked 3 months for another employer. In such a
    terrible hurry to get their hands on money with no concern about the effect
    of having to refile. After cashing out on their original return, they would bring
    in another W-2 and pay another $50 to get the amended return filled out.
    I believe the amended returns resulted in a bigger refund maybe 60-70%
    of the time.

    His office processes over 2000 returns typically, and I hope with the shutdown
    of the other competitor, he will do over 3000 this year. Population in his county
    is around 25,000 including children. Not bad for the kind of operation he has.

    Maybe some of you will find this interesting. It was quite interesting for
    myself as well.

    #2
    Oh Dear

    Snags,

    We need to get you a real job, where your wonderful talents and knowledge can be put to the best use. Altho I think it is good for all of us to witness some of the scenarios that you described, but how can one do that on a daily basis? I think I would quit the "tax business" if that is what my practice was.

    Sandy

    Comment


      #3
      I'd rather flip hamburgers

      If I had to deal with that type of client, I'd definitely quit the tax business. All those self-employed EIC people supporting six kids on an income of $ 5000 are enough to make you want to call the IRS whistle blower line.

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by Snaggletooth View Post
        Well folks, it had to happen sooner or later. I am between jobs with nothing
        going on except my 120 tax clients. A friend of mine runs a fast refund tax
        place, and had one of his people quit, so I offered to come help him for a
        couple weeks during the heat of the season. It was a real fire drill.

        I've heard all the horror stories from the earned income crowd, and had the
        opportunity to see just how bad it was. A 350 lb. woman came in and said
        she cleaned houses for a living. No W-2, no 1099, but claimed she cleaned
        4 houses a week for $50 per house. A daughter she claimed lived with her
        meant [poof!!] a $2500 refund. Dropped her handbag and she couldn't bend
        over to pick it up. But she cleans houses for a living. Also I was amazed
        at the large number of customers who had no bank accounts.

        Even with me helping, the office was swamped. The IRS had shut down
        another fast tax place in town for undisclosed reasons, and my friend was
        getting the overflow. One customer came in to get her taxes done, and said
        she had worked at the other place before they shut it down. My friend hired
        her on the spot, after filling out her taxes. I kid you not.

        I found out quickly about my friend's expertise. He knew more than any of
        his crew, but he knew more about e-filing and bank products than anything
        else. Overall, a decent guy and not a crook. I brought him "grey area" decisions
        to make since these were his customers. Most of the time he was easier
        than myself, but not always.

        The "fast tax" option was with a bank I never heard of, and to be honest
        with you, the fees were reasonable. A flat $35 plus about 54% interest. This
        may sound high, but the total fee was about 1/3 of what was being charged
        by HRB in most cases. Charges never ran over $220 even including the
        preparers' fee. If all RALs were this reasonable, I would not be so adamant
        against them.

        One of the other experienced preparers attempted to coax customers into
        claiming enough income to reach some $15,000 where EIC is maximized.
        I had a real problem with that. I would estimate some 50% of these people
        were lying about either their marital status or children, or maybe both. One
        woman brought in six social security cards with five different last names,
        all of them supposedly her own children. Supporting all of them as head
        of household on a $9000 W-2.

        There was a huge number of amended returns, and he wanted me to do all
        of them because I knew more about them. People would come in and
        somehow "forget" they worked 3 months for another employer. In such a
        terrible hurry to get their hands on money with no concern about the effect
        of having to refile. After cashing out on their original return, they would bring
        in another W-2 and pay another $50 to get the amended return filled out.
        I believe the amended returns resulted in a bigger refund maybe 60-70%
        of the time.

        His office processes over 2000 returns typically, and I hope with the shutdown
        of the other competitor, he will do over 3000 this year. Population in his county
        is around 25,000 including children. Not bad for the kind of operation he has.

        Maybe some of you will find this interesting. It was quite interesting for
        myself as well.
        3000 returns at let's say...$200. $600,000 Gross. Average pay for his preparers about $7-$10. Not bad, huh? It's shameful how government programs like EIC work, isn't it? They want tax preparer's to be the "watchdogs" over programs rampant with abuse. And...word gets around on how to be the system, doesn't it?

        Comment


          #5
          I would be very cautious working for a place like that. Eventually, you are going to be confronted with the decision to prepare a correct return, verses please a customer and ultimately the boss. Your boss is in the business of catering to EIC and RAL clients with one eye blind to what is really going on. If and when IRS eventually decides to swoop in and shut down your boss’s business (as they apparently did across town), you could be lumped in with the rest of the preparers. Bad association can get you in trouble.

          Comment


            #6
            I have zero doubt Snag handled this situation properly. But, it is a dillema. I would like to know how he handled the situations he described?

            Comment


              #7
              RALs

              I work at an H&R Block Premium office, so we don't get much of the EIC crowd and seldom do RALs. I do one RAL every year or two, but of course get all the training materials. The bank, HSBC, charges about $29.95 ($25.95?) plus interest which tops out at under 36% if the refund is put on the HRB Emerald debit VISA card. I'm not a fan of RALs. But, after working with those clients, would you loan one of them $2,500 for a couple of weeks for less than $60 or so in fees and interest in the hopes that the IRS really sends the entire refund without question in a timely manner? I love being a tax preparer but would probably never be a bank!

              Comment


                #8
                On My Own

                To satisfy anyone's curiosity, I was really on my own and did not get pressure from the owner to cave in to customers. One customer was furious after working a farm for 10 years, wanted to sell his entire house plus acreage as a residence, and not take gains on the farmland. The customer demanded to talk to the owner, and the owner backed me up. There were a few "grey areas" and I let the owner decide.

                I don't think the IRS will shut that office down. The EIC money grab is entirely out-of-hand everywhere, and if you don't know the customers are lying there are limits on what you can be expected to do.

                This is their 10th year, and after the 2nd year, my friend's wife wrote a letter to both Tennessee Senators, the President, and her Congressman about the horrendous abuse of the EIC. She received no response from any of them except her Congressman, Bart Gordon (D-Murfreesboro TN). Her Congressman wrote that he thought the EIC program was "wonderful, and a marvelous boost to our economy." But he added that tax preparers should make "every effort to stop fraudulent abuse." Ridiculous.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by Snaggletooth View Post
                  To satisfy anyone's curiosity, I was really on my own and did not get pressure from the owner to cave in to customers. One customer was furious after working a farm for 10 years, wanted to sell his entire house plus acreage as a residence, and not take gains on the farmland. The customer demanded to talk to the owner, and the owner backed me up. There were a few "grey areas" and I let the owner decide.

                  I don't think the IRS will shut that office down. The EIC money grab is entirely out-of-hand everywhere, and if you don't know the customers are lying there are limits on what you can be expected to do.

                  This is their 10th year, and after the 2nd year, my friend's wife wrote a letter to both Tennessee Senators, the President, and her Congressman about the horrendous abuse of the EIC. She received no response from any of them except her Congressman, Bart Gordon (D-Murfreesboro TN). Her Congressman wrote that he thought the EIC program was "wonderful, and a marvelous boost to our economy." But he added that tax preparers should make "every effort to stop fraudulent abuse." Ridiculous.
                  And, so it goes...abuse...waste...fraud. Welcome to the US Government 101.

                  Comment

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