Notary & Federal Regs

[taxmandan]

Sort of...

194.164 Maximum fees for notarial acts; exception; rules. (1) The Secretary of State shall adopt by rule a schedule fixing the maximum fees that a notary public may charge for performing notarial acts. The schedule shall include, but not be limited to, maximum fees for the following notarial acts:

(a) Acknowledgments.

(b) Oaths or affirmations without a signature.

(c) Verifications upon oath or affirmation.

(d) Copy certifications.

(e) Protesting commercial paper, except that no fees shall be allowed for protesting a check because of the insolvency of the financial institution upon which the check was written.

(2) A notary public may charge an additional fee for traveling to perform a notarial act if:

(a) The notary explains to the person requesting the notarial act that the fee is in addition to the fee specified under subsection (1) of this section and is not required by law; and

(b) The person requesting the notarial act agrees in advance upon the amount of the additional fee.

(3) Notaries shall display an English-language schedule of fees for notarial acts, as specified under subsection (1) of this section. [1989 c.976 §24; 1997 c.631 §424]

The application for a Notary states that fees cannot be charged. A person has to apply for a waiver in order to charge fees. I don't know if the waiver is automatically approved or not, but the SOS office told me that no fees could be charged and didn't mention the waiver. Oh well, the fees allowed on the waiver by ORS 160-100-420 aren't worth the trouble anyway IMO.

[Fees]

160-100-0400

Maximum Amount of Notary Fees Permitted to be Charged

A notary public shall not charge, attempt to charge, or receive a notary fee that is more than:

(1) $5 for taking an acknowledgment;

(2) $5 for taking a verification upon an oath or affirmation;

(3) $5 for certifying a copy of a document;

(4) $5 for witnessing or attesting a signature;

(5) $5 for protesting commercial paper, except a check drawn on an insolvent financial institution in which case the fee is $0;

(6) $1 for administering an oath or affirmation without a signature;

(7) $1 for taking a deposition, each page;

(8) $1 for all other notarial acts not specified in this rule.

Stat. Auth.: ORS 194
Stats. Implemented: ORS 194.164
Hist.: SOS-AD 2-1990, f. 5-9-90, cert. ef. 7-1-90; CORP 1-1993, f. 12-29-93, cert. ef. 1-1-94; Renumbered from 164-100-0400

[Roberts]

I don't think they are charging excess fees for the notary stamp and earning $70,000 per year. They are charging for travel expenses and convenience fees which add up quickly. In my state we are supposed to charge $2.00 per stamp. But we can charge whatever we want to show up at someones office and then charge them $2 per stamp. A friend of mine is a real estate agent and they do closings all over the place because it is out in the country and many buyers are from out of state. He has a notary (actually his best friend) and they slip in charges of $100 per hour in fees including his commute time. His fees are paid by the attorney handling the closing and they just slip it all into the closing costs.

[Bertandbull]

Fees and Notary Signings

The fees that you are posting are for what state? Every state has their own definitions of what can be charged for Acknowledgements, jurats, protests ect. ect., each state has their own laws on what fees and how much can be charged in addition to acks, jurats ect ect..( if any at all)

The loan signing business, is not something to just jump into. There is more work than telling the borrowerers where to sign. Many long distant phone calls, long distant car rides, companies not having the paperwork ready and your appointment is in 10 minutes and you are home waiting for your fax to arrive and you STILL have to travel 40 miles to borrowers home. Then after you get there the company forgot one paper(ARRGH). Then there is the time spent running after all of your payments from these companies.
If you got the stamina, and much much needed patience then I would consider it.

[Unregistered]

The fees that you are posting are for what state?

Fees are for Oregon

[Black Bart]

Sounds a lot like

The loan signing business, is not something to just jump into. There is more work than telling the borrowerers where to sign. Many long distant phone calls, long distant car rides, companies not having the paperwork ready and your appointment is in 10 minutes and you are home waiting for your fax to arrive and you STILL have to travel 40 miles to borrowers home. Then after you get there the company forgot one paper(ARRGH). Then there is the time spent running after all of your payments from these companies.
If you got the stamina, and much much needed patience then I would consider it.

the tax business (with the exception of the long distance car rides).

About the notary fees -- it's mighty considerate indeed of legislators to put a cap of five bucks on 'em for the benefit of the citizenry. But further restricting it to absolute zero demonstrates a sense of almost pure nobility in public service. I wonder how they'd feel if a proposal was made to limit legislative pay to the 0-$5 range?

[Jiggers]

Thats why I quit being Notary

the tax business (with the exception of the long distance car rides).

About the notary fees -- it's mighty considerate indeed of legislators to put a cap of five bucks on 'em for the benefit of the citizenry. But further restricting it to absolute zero demonstrates a sense of almost pure nobility in public service. I wonder how they'd feel if a proposal was made to limit legislative pay to the 0-$5 range?

Sometimes it took 10 - 20 minutes to get a document ready for the signature, including getting proper ID registered in notary records book. It was not worth the $1 - $5 that I was getting. Plus the cost of the book and bond and licensing fees.

I am not in this business not to make money.

[jainen]

no independents

>>restricting it to absolute zero demonstrates a sense of almost pure nobility in public service<<

Nobility? I don't think so. What they have done is ensure that notarization is controlled by the bankers, who can afford to keep someone on staff for the benefit of their own customers. It doesn't mean no notaries, just no independents.

[Black Bart]

What's the difference?

...ensure that notarization is controlled by the bankers...no independents.

Can they charge more than we do or is it worth it to them because of the volume?

P.S. They don't keep somebody on staff just for that; they just get seals for the secretaries.

[jainen]

the stuff the money guys hate

>>What's the difference?<<

The independents are -- well, independent. Like disinterested, fair & balanced, objective -- all the stuff the money guys hate.

[Koss]

Tax Pros &amp; Notaries

I'll offer my two cents' worth on this...

I agree with the previous posts that the restriction only prohibits the tax pro from notarizing a document that is related to a tax matter. And in general, most documents that need to be notarized are not documents that are truly tax matters.

With that being said...

Suppose the document is a partnership agreement for a client who is starting a new business. Are you breaking the rules if you notarize the agreement and then prepare the 1065?

Suppose the document is an auto title that reflects a donative transfer of the vehicle to a charitable organization.

Hmmmmmm?

How far down the rabbit hole do you want to go? Almost anything could be tax-related. I think the restriction only applies to documents that are specifically drafted as part of an IRS proceeding. I don't think the EA/notary is expected to somehow predict whether a document will or will not become part of tax matter at some point in the future.

If you take the position that a partnership agreement is a tax-related document, then it also becomes a chicken-egg problem. If the person is not your tax client when they come and ask you to notarize the partnership, are you somehow prohibited from then taking them as a client and doing the 1065 because you notarized it? I don't think so.

FYI: Attorneys are prohibited from notarizing any document that is part of a case in which they are representing the person who signed it. This is the same concept. But it only applies to litigation. An attorney can notarize the signatures on a partnership agreement that he himself wrote for the client. But he cannot notarize an affidavit that is prepared in response to a discovery request served on his client if he is representing the client in the lawsuit that generated the discovery request.

The restriction on tax pros probably only applies to adversial matters involving the IRS.

Burton