Puiblic embarressment-nt

[kathyc2]

I love to peruse the candidates tax returns. In most years the firm that prepared Pence's returns took the entire prep fee of 600-800 as a deduction on his wife's small Sch C which had average revenue of around 1K per year. Ooops!

[Jiggers]

I love to peruse the candidates tax returns. In most years the firm that prepared Pence's returns took the entire prep fee of 600-800 as a deduction on his wife's small Sch C which had average revenue of around 1K per year. Ooops!

Maybe that having to file a Schedule C was the reason that a paid preparer had to be used. He might have been able to self-prepare his own return.

I have clients that for years filed their own return without any C, E, or F. Then when they added a Schedule C, E, or F they needed assistance because of depreciation or Schedule SE and just wasn't sure, I would put the total prep fee on that schedule.

[New York Enrolled Agent]

Maybe that having to file a Schedule C was the reason that a paid preparer had to be used. He might have been able to self-prepare his own return.

I have clients that for years filed their own return without any C, E, or F. Then when they added a Schedule C, E, or F they needed assistance because of depreciation or Schedule SE and just wasn't sure, I would put the total prep fee on that schedule.

Your argument might have some credence in your scenario ( though RevRuling 92-29 probably suggests otherwise) but looking at the returns prior to any Schedule C on these returns, it seems significant tax prep fees were listed on Schedule A for the Pence returns. Given the dollars involved in the income for Schedule C business versus other income on the return, I think Kathy's point is well taken.

[Nashville]

Who is the REAL villain?

I have been hearing for years that IRS is doing their best to disallow Sch C deductions for tax prep, and force the expenses into Misc Deductions on Sch A subject to the 2% floor. (2% usually means the tax prep fees become non-deductible) You can certainly understand how that would be a money grab for an auditor.

I am old and creaky enough to remember this came with the 1986 tax law change. For the most part, the law did away with large masses taking itemized deductions, which also prompted the need for many tax preparers. A notable exception was a business, farm, or rental which escaped the curtailment of Sch A.

Whether IRS likes it or not, the literal application would allocate a portion of the preparer's fee to Sch A if a business, farm, or rental was involved. This would be the most "righteous" interpretation (as if that makes any difference to anyone). And if there WERE a business, the personal allocation would normally be so infintissimaly small as to be negligible.

As far as political figures are concerned, I could find much more to lose sleep about than a Sch C deduction for tax prep. Kathy2 lives in Indiana and certainly would know more about Mr. Pence than I do.

[kathyc2]

I didn't say anyone was a villain, nor was I making a comment on Pence. We all make mistakes, and if it occurred in only one year, I wouldn't have thought much about it. If a return that I prepared was made public to millions and contained such a error, I would be mortified. I just found it comical.

[taxmom34]

I would love to see copy of Trump's tax return. on news tonight his son said Trump will not release his return because it is 1200 pages. what? did any of you ever send a return with 1200 pages? and Eric also said dad's return are not under audit. I was under impression that audits are normally done two years after filing, am I wrong?

[kathyc2]

I would love to see copy of Trump's tax return. on news tonight his son said Trump will not release his return because it is 1200 pages. what? did any of you ever send a return with 1200 pages? and Eric also said dad's return are not under audit. I was under impression that audits are normally done two years after filing, am I wrong?

Actually, they are saying 12,000 pages. He has ownership in something like 500 pass through businesses, so I'm guessing they are including that in the 12K number.

[kathyc2]

Not wanting to get into politics, but did anyone else notice the latest Trump plan does away with HOH status? Presumably, they would need to file as single which could lead to some big increases in tax.

[Burke]

Actually, they are saying 12,000 pages. He has ownership in something like 500 pass through businesses, so I'm guessing they are including that in the 12K number.

Not to mention all the REITs, investment sales on Sche D, multiple Sche E's, limited partnership K-1's (including all the non-resident state returns with copies of the federal pages he must have to file), I'm guessing. He may even be including any closely-held Corporations in which he is a shareholder and/or salaried officer. Which is the issue if anyone cares. If he discloses anything, I would be floored. His son is right about one thing; hundreds of CPA's, etc would be posing questions for the next 2 months about issue after issue, if he were to do so. So don't expect it. I am also assuming he is claiming FL residency......

[TAXNJ]

Just trying to understand the reason (not law) for looking at candidates tax returns. Some candidates or current office holders give very little to charity or whatever. Some may give more. So what is it that you would be looking at and for what reasons?

Be fair and look at all candidates tax info if interested. What benefits did you get by reviewing these returns?

If one had 1200 or 12000 pages then that is what it will be. Are you going to spend the time to analyze all the pages? Wil you be able to understand 1/2 of the pages and information? What will it tell you?

What about the candidate who had less than a $1m when running for office and today while in office is a millionaire! How did that happen? Did you net worth increase like that? What did you find reviewing those returns?

What about the candidate when leaving office said they were broke and today worth $225m. Now did you look at those returns and what benefits did you discover? Can you apply it to your business?

All we know is that the US is in big debt that has to be paid back somehow

[kathyc2]

There can be any number of reasons for voters to want to see tax returns of candidates. The most important one to me is seeing how tax changes they want to make will affect them personally.

[Burke]

Good point, but the 1040 doesn't show that much. The other entity returns might show more pertinent information about deductions and/or credits. The financial reports dated July 2016 at http://pfds.opensecrets.org/N00023864_2015_Pres.pdf are worth a look.

[TAXNJ]

Good point, but the 1040 doesn't show that much. The other entity returns might show more pertinent information about deductions and/or credits. The financial reports dated 2015 at http://pfds.opensecrets.org/N00023864_2015_Pres.pdf are worth a look.

Agree with your comment to cathyc2 that the 1040 would not show that much other than showing how some went from very little income to multi-millionaires in a short time frame.

Also, cathyc2 never said if the tax preparation fees were disallowed!

Your other reply said you assume Trump has FL residency but he voted in NY therefore think he is a NY resident

Yes, financial reports of the one candidate provides more relevant information over 90 pages to keep one busy reading. But thought you were sharing the F/S of all candidates!

Now being fair, looking forward to the posting of the F/S of all the candidates before some may think it is partisan!

[kathyc2]

Nothing partisan here in spite of your attempt to make it so....

[Burke]

candidate provides more relevant information over 90 pages to keep one busy reading. But thought you were sharing the F/S of all candidates!
Now being fair, looking forward to the posting of the F/S of all the candidates before some may think it is partisan!

The website www.opensecrets.org which is sponsored by the Center for Responsive Politics has now posted all four candidates. I tried to input the link for the home page in my prior post, but could not get it to work. And only Clinton and Trump's records were up -- hers in a format I could not decipher. It now appears to have been corrected and updated to 2016. Hers is 11 pages. I have not reviewed the other 2 candidates' yet. I have found the easiest way to access is to type "Presidential Candidates Financial Disclosures" into Google, and then click on the opensecrets.org link. You may then select any of the four candidates' information.