bookkeeping

[sea-tax]

Bookkeeping and similar type services make up a large say 1/3rd of my revenues. My question is those of you who provide similar type services do you employee people to help you and if so have you made them go through the AIPB certification? That is the American Institute of Professional Bookkeepers. Is there other certifications out there that are better or more appropriate?

I have not but I do employe about 6 to 7 full time bookkeepers and am now wondering if this is something I should encourage them to do.

[BOB W]

Employees

If you have that many bookkeepers it would seem very productive if they were Certified. Getting them certified would mean you would have less followup work to do. They would be able to data entry more accurately as well as handle other upper level accounting issues. I say go for it. Pick your best and make her/him first.

[sea-tax]

Bob W do you have many bookkeeping accounts? If so how many? Do you do the work yourself or hire employees.

[BOB W]

Bookkeeping

I have 55 monthly write up clients. Let me say first, data entry varies with each client. Some clients have only 25 checks/entries and others have 400 checks. The bulk are in the 75-100 check catagory. My wife takes care of all of them, including the bank recs in 2 weeks per month. I do a final review of each account each month. I make adjusting entries, if needed, and issue internal Financial Statements to each and every one of them, monthly.

[theresa d]

fees

bob if you don't mind me asking could you give a ball park figure on how you charge your monthly clients? do you charge per number of checks written etc?

[BOB W]

Fees

Well it is a combination of time it takes to enter monthly info and what it is going to take to process all monthly activity. Do they have payroll, how many employees, what about sub contractors and/ or people that will need 1099s at the end of the year, how many loans do I have to keep track of, will they buy assets frequently and are they financed, is there more than one shareholder.... There are so many factors that make up my monthly fee it is hard to say how I bill, but the important items are time and complexity.

When I have a new client coming on board I start out looking at the quantity of checks, debit card items on their bank statements ( aren't they always problems), and other time consuming items. I give them a starting fee, based on my experience, and tell them I will start there and I will see where your activity takes my fees.

If it looks like I'm going to spend an hour per month I will start out at $250- $300. You have to remember I am TOTALY optimized (intregrated) with all my software, that I pay so dearly for, and just because I can get the work done quickly does not mean I give it away. And my monthly fee includes everything up to and including the Corporate Return. Sometimes I include their personal return if it is a basic itemized return.

[theresa d]

thanks bob

for the quick response. i acquired some accounts several years ago from a relative who retired and his fees were very low. i've been gradually increasing them but it hasn't been easy. it's helpful to know what other professionals charge since i beleive you're in the long island area also. helps to block out all the screaming from some clients when i increase. thanks.

[BOB W]

When .....

.... I increase their fees, I never ask them I just do it. Most clients don't quibble but the one that do I remind them of what has happened to their business recently. No matter what I say they still complain and I tell them that is what I need to handle their account, more or less telling them "take it or leave it".

Many year ago I realized that if you are timid about your fees your clients will react as if you are over charging them. Be bold and straight forward and believe in yourself. Also be ready to loose a client. One of the worse posistions to be in is to be afraid to loose a client.

[veritas]

Bob,

Did you come out ot he Comprhensive organization?

[BOB W]

What?

I don't understand your reply??????

[sea-tax]

I am similar to Bob W in the sense that I also charge average around 250-300 but I do not include the tax fee in that price. I like to bill seperate for that. However I learned long ago that best thing for creating bookkeeping revenue is to charge one flat fee. I charge 250-300 on average some more some less. That however includes payroll up to 5 employees, payroll reports, profit and loss , W2's&1099's and Washington Excise tax Return. I feel like one price everymonth makes me different from the people who charge by the hour. This way client can budget, now sure some months I win and some I loose but I definately win more than I loose. Plus every year like Bob W I raise the fee for cost of living or pain in the rear.

[theresa d]

price increase

how much do you raise your fee each year? do you increase it every year? i'm in the ballpark with you and bob. i charge between 175-275\month but i also charge extra for the corporate and personal returns. i was debating about charging extra for payroll tax and sales tax returns verses increasing their monthly fee but decided against that. decided to stay with the monthly fee that includes all or i'd constantly be expaining my fee.

agree that some months gain and some months lose but i think on the whole i'm coming in where i want to be.

[sea-tax]

5 to 10% depending on certain client. less employees/checks 5% more 10%

[geekgirldany]

Well I can tell by this thread that I need to increase my charges. I charge by the hour with a two hour minimum. I charge separate though for bookkeeping, payroll, and tax prep. Very informative thread.

[BOB W]

Increases.........

......... is not what it is all about. What it is about is being fair to "yourself" and being fair to your "clients". The old "win-win". That doesn't mean your clients will like it but you have to know it is right.

I have clients that I have not increased in 5 years, others that I've decreased, and still others that I have increased. Increase for the sake of increase is not good. But you have to look at you geographical area and find out what your competition is doing.

Increases have to make sense to you, because you have to justify them if called upon. If you flinch, you are in trouble.