Roni Deutch

[Burke]

Latest news? Lawsuit by CA Attorney General Jerry Brown for fraud. She says it is "political."

[joanmcq]

She's a fraud. I hope Jerry proves it. She's a huge blot on our profession. and annoying, besides.

[Snaggletoof]

Annoying

Joan, I don't know anything about Sir Jerry's lawsuit but at a minimum Roni Deutsch is definitely annoying. I think the entire tax defense industry has blossomed with these commercials in the last 2-3 years and for most of the money they make, is made for either doing nothing, or else doing something that a tax preparer (or even the taxpayer) could have done for a fraction of their fees.

I do believe there is (and always has been) a need for firms who have the legal experience to fight the IRS in court for taxpayers who owe big ticket tax bills. I have on a couple occasions referred taxpayers to J K Harris, who from my experience, have people on board who are realistic and experienced. And even his firm runs these ridiculous ads on TV. Deutsch ads are without question the most irritating and tasteless.

What galls me is the actual number of people listening to these ads who can really be helped is amazingly small. First peel away the listeners who can actually pay the IRS from future earnings or currently owned property. That peels away over 50% of them from the start. Then peel away those whose actual liability is overstated because they didn't respond to a CP notice, or have miscalculated their taxes. Then peel away those who are going to lie to their representative (which is often why they're in trouble to begin with) and can't be helped as a result. Then peel away some more who could be helped by a local tax preparer or other representative without having to pay thousands of dollars up front.

The ads are very appealing to listeners who think they can get away without paying taxes, and I truly believe most of them are not as innocent as the ads appeal to begin with. After peeling away the people mentioned above, the market for people who can really be helped by these firms is only a very small percentage of the listeners. The market does exist, but is small indeed. Someone who has been properly assessed can only be helped if he doesn't have anything, doesn't make any money, won't ever have anything, or won't ever make any money.

[dyne]

I recommend that you enter J K Harris Complaints in GOOGLE and do the same for Roni Deutch and
J G Wenworth and Tax Masters!

[joanmcq]

JK Harris is just as bad. I had a client who sent them $1500 (before he was my client) to do an OIC, and got nothing but stalls. Qualified based on income, but tax due was based on SFRs; he needed to file all back years before he could even submit. and, of course had no docs, so I was digging through eservices & requesting transcripts to even put together a return.

I can do a better job for a heck of a lot less than any of these firms.

[MLINDER42]

Ronnie Deutch

I agree completely have not done an OIC but have handled several people who owed.Always had to file some returns and than usually was able to do an installment agreement full or partial pay or put them in noncollectable status.I also charge much less also with very little upfront.

[DaveO]

I've done a number of OIC and tell the clients that we won't be cheaper than the late night TV guys but will see the job through and will not make an offer that can't be accepted or take their money before I examine their case and determine if an offer is possible.

[joanmcq]

same here. I'll review their info and be able to determine if an OIC is even an option. I do installments all the time for clients that don't listen if they have a windfall (or don't contact me before they withdraw retirement funds to buy gold or some other thing). I've done all of two OICs, and both were accepted.

[Edsel]

Jerry Brown

So Jerry Brown is going after Roni Deutch?

Thass O.K. He once went after Linda Ronstadt.

He would have been better off....

[Edsel]

Tax Resolution Complaints

I wouldn't in a heartbeat defend Roni Deutsch, JKHarris, TaxMasters, or any of these firms for their unsavory practices. They give our industry a black eye, and their TV ads are insulting our intelligence.

But we have been referred to "Google Up" complaint boards, where huge numbers of complaints have been registered against these firms. The number of complaints seem to be in proportion to the size of the company being googled.

What kind of customers do these firms have to begin with? The two criteria seems to be people who owe TONS of money to the IRS, and people who hope they can get away with paying little or nothing. Almost all of you on this forum are tax preparers with customers.

In your experience, what kind of customers are those who owe tons of money, and who believe they can get away with paying little or nothing? Whereas some of them are victims of bad reporting or bad circumstances, the overwhelming majority of them are people who made a bunch of money and had it available but squandered it on everything but paying their taxes. Also people who have not filed in years, but IRS has now caught up with them. If you can't help them, they can find "Shifty-Eyed Sam" across town, although even he will head for the hills if he knows IRS is hot on the trail.

These complaint boards do warn people of shams and as such provide a service. But the complaints from people who are pissed at tax resolution firms? Hacked off at TaxMasters. Hacked off at IRS. Hacked off at H&RBlock. Hacked off at the corner loan company. Hacked off at their lawyer. If you can't help them, then they're hacked off at YOU.

They can start a complaint blog about your little corner office tax prep business.

And they don't even have to sign their name.

[joanmcq]

Thing is, there are also a lot of people that I see that owe lots and either a. screwed up the TurboTax and now owe a refund they got but can't pay back, b. made a lot in the years in question but are now unemployed, underemployed, etc. and now can't pay, and/or c. really screwed up in the past and are now trying to come clean. Or maybe d. got really bad tax advice/prep and are on the hook, or e. got a CP2000 for stock sales that shows they owe $500,000.

Thing is Roni and her type of firms don't tell these folks about the options. Still got a viable biz, but just had no idea of the SE tax and got into trouble? I'd advise an installment agreement and maybe charge $50. much less if I prepared the return. or nothing, and send 'em to the IRS website once they figure out what they can pay. I am NOT going to charge you thousands up front and misrepresent the installment agreement as "I went to bat for you and got you payments of only $500/mo! and made sure they will stop hassling you for it as well!" If they are really CNC, doing a 433-A isn't too much trouble, but I'll let them know that once they are back on their feet, if they get back on their feet, they will still owe, barring the SOL. The CP2000? Easy fix if they've got the basis.

I am not going to lie to make what I do look better, or promise something I can't deliver. The biggest complaint on the boards seems to be that they paid the retainer and got nothing. not even an installment agreement.

[Edsel]

433A and B

Just letting our minds wander into the land of the tax relief business.....zzzz

Wonder how much work Roni's people do gathering information for the 433s??

I won't even do this work myself, let alone someone who charges $1500 up front. I'll bet the client is told, "Go home and dig all this stuff out, summarize it, and send it to us." Wouldn't surprise me if 50% of their clients can't (or maybe won't) even do this.

We are not in a position to dig this information out anyway. A couple of people I've tried to help just simply don't want to do this. If they don't, I can't help them.

[thomtax]

And I am getting three or four calls a week trying to "give me" a Roni Deutch franchise just to get into my area. I think I'll jump right on that! NOT

LT

[Bonnie]

Client

I have a client who came to me initially after not filing for years and being paid with a 1099. Repeated letters from IRS were ignored and finally client got scared and called Roni Deutch. After paying about $2200 to Roni, client was told he needed to find someone to prepare his tax returns (about 5 years worth). That's when they contacted me. This was several years ago and I'd never heard of Roni Deutch but told them they shouldn't be paying someone to help then and then having to hire me to prepare their taxes. Told the client he could handle this himself and I would help. But they had already paid the money. I did prepare many years of returns for them which they in turn sent to Roni Deutch. The lady kept telling me all that was going on. And most of the work was left for the client to do. After a long time, year to year and a half, they finally settled. Not sure that Roni was any help at all. We discussed this at tax season this year and the lady told me they should have not paid Roni and sent that money to the IRS. That was the advice I gave them first time I talked with them. My client will be paying the IRS for years to get this all settled.

[geekgirldany]

I had a client that went to Roni and JK. Paid Roni $3,500 to be told no OIC but they would set up and installment agreement for her. She still wanted to do a OIC so went to JK two years later and paid $1,500 to be told you don't qualify for an OIC now. Continue to pay on your installment agreement. But sign a contract for us to do the bookkeeping (had biz) and taxes for so many years and you may become eligible later on.

Came to me and I started preparing tax returns. Wanted me to do an OIC... looked like she qualified but I told her of a local EA in town that done these on a regular basis. That he would tell her straight off if she qualified or not and would not charge very much for the consultation.

What happened.... she went to JK Harris again. I still do the taxes but don't say a word when she mentions the passed due amount.