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    Auditors and HRB

    A few days ago, one of our members told us about the "audit from hell." The auditor insisted on documentation that is not required, and documentation that the client (not the preparer) should keep. I emphasize that this "audit" was targeted at the preparer and NOT clients, whom I am told get a "free pass" even when EIC defalcations are discovered.

    I would like to ask some of our HRB people (e.g. Oxtrainer, Gary M, Oleander) whether any of their offices are invaded by this kind of audit, and if so, what happens?

    My hunch is that IRS would rather not, as they would meet resistance from the vast resources of a large, publicly traded company. I know from observation that they can be very obtrusive and unfair to one-horse shops (like myself), and to small businesses.

    On the contrary, I am told that the IRS consults with Block on many issues, such as forms design, E-file protocol and other items. I suspect that their interface with Block might even exceed the audience received by our own organizations such as NAEA and NATP. Looking at this as a positive, it may give HRB an enhanced opportunity to make its voice heard for our profession.

    When I hear of audits like this which are targeted at preparers (instead of going after EIC known to be fraudulent) it makes me increasingly wary of them regulating our industry. Although there is broad acceptance from most of our board members, I think arbitrary and abusive government directives will replace unscrupulous preparers as the bane of our industry.

    Any Block people care to tell us about IRS auditing their offices, and what usually is the outcome?
    Last edited by Snaggletooth; 05-16-2010, 01:41 AM.

    #2
    when i worked for HRB many years ago, the audits were normally in the summer months, so the ones responding to them would be the year round staff that work in the district office. so , not sure about members here who would have knowledge of audits. the only time i heard of problems was at office mgr's meetings, my office had zero errors for three years.

    Comment


      #3
      I can only tell you that our office has never received any type of deferential treatment. Whether it be concerning an audit or any other matter. We are a franchise, not a company store. My boss has had this franchise for 42 years. He has had his share of audits. On site and in Austin. There was no talk of going easier because he was from Block.
      He wins some and he loses some. Just like I'm sure everyone here has.

      We have had mostly mail audits lately. Believe me, the IRS couldn't care less that a Block office is handling it.
      You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say will be misquoted, then used against you.

      Comment


        #4
        Oleander

        Interesting response, Miss Oleander. I would not think an audit of a client would result in preferential treatment just because Block prepared it. I also applaud the fact the Block represents their clients at audit as a free service.

        My question deals, however, with whether Block is receiving "preparer" audit visits, and what kind of interface is occurring. Also, please understand I am not "bashing" Block by suspecting IRS would be slower in assessing penalties. On the contrary, I would be rather proud of such stature that someone is able to resist them (if this is what's happening).

        Have you had preparer audits at your office, or have you heard of other HRB offices who have had them?

        Thanks for responding.

        Comment


          #5
          Ct

          I worked for HRB for 11 years in CT. Our district went from the NYS line through Fairfield and New Haven Counties. I never heard of an office or a preparer being audited or visited by the IRS during tax season. Or, at any time, for that matter. Except for the time after my second season, I worked every off-season through November or December 2007. I taught courses and took a huge number of courses, so interfaced with lots of the preparers. The only IRS agents I saw were at client audits or CtSEA meetings!

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Snaggletooth View Post
            I also applaud the fact the Block represents their clients at audit as a free service.
            Unless something has changed recently, at least in regard to the HRB office in my area, HRB doen not "represent" their clients at audit. They specifically state in their guarantee that they will accompany the taxpayer to the audit to explain how the tax retrun was prepared but not "represent" the client. The wording is from memory and is almost surely not exact but the principle is the same.

            Note that they will provide representation for an additional fee. The representation is definitely NOT a FREE service.

            While some may not see that as a big difference, I seem like a huge difference to me.

            Lennox C. Boush, EA
            Lennox C. (Len) Boush, EA, FNTPI
            Heritage Income Tax Service, Inc.
            Portsmouth, VA

            Comment


              #7
              I'm a blockhead too

              Actually, all HRB Premium office clients, online clients, Tax Cut clients and regular store "Peace of Mind Guarantee" (additional fee) HRB clients get audit representation as part of their service. All other retail clients (about 50% of the total) do indeed pay if they want representation rather than assistance. I can say that our price is a bargain compared to getting a CPA.

              One of our local franchise offices is having a preparer audit currently and the owner is in hot water, so it does happen.
              Last edited by snowshine; 05-17-2010, 10:55 AM. Reason: left out info

              Comment


                #8
                Client Audits

                Through 2007 in our Block district, our Premium office clients received free audit representation and those that purchased Peace of Mind in regular offices received free audit representation. Other clients and non-clients could purchase the services of an EA for audit representation.

                Comment


                  #9
                  I have not heard of any preparer audits concerning Block.
                  You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say will be misquoted, then used against you.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Block does have some tracking on preparers. The Premium offices include the full Peace of Mind Extended Service Guarantee as part of the fee for tax preparation. For other offices it is an additional cost service. Preparers can see if any claims have been filed by any of their clients.

                    I have seen at least one Block office removed from eFiling due to the volume of rejected returns. So it can happen.

                    H&R Block like the very large CPA firms can afford the overhead of having one or more individuals sit on IRS advisory boards or provide extensive comments to IRS request for comments.

                    H&R Block has added a position at the corporate level to deal with EIC quality issues. This step is proactive on their part to prevent the IRS from flagging H&R Block because of EIC issues. This might not stop that from happening, but it will H&R Block to possibly identify lax or problem preparers and take action before the IRS.

                    H&R Block also has mandatory training and required testing of tax knowledge for rehiring. And this program has been in place for a number of years in anticipation of the IRS actions in this area.

                    H&R Block is pushing their long term employees to become EAs and offer in house training targeted at the EA exam.

                    Block has EAs with power of attorney represent clients at audit. Because some of these EAs appear frequently in front of IRS auditors, they may learn how best to represent the taxpayer during an audit better than other EAs. There are some H&R Block districts that rely on EAs in another district to represent their clients because of the tax knowledge, skill level, and personal skills of these EAs. These EAs may also know how best to handle a difficult IRS auditor and how best to negotiate a settlement on an audit point or the entire audit.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Mr. Kaiser,

                      I presume.

                      Thank you for this detailed response. Interesting to know all of the information that you described.

                      In recent years, I have changed my outlook on HRB. In former days, I would think of how I would go behind some of their green preparers and find ridiculous mistakes as well as being critical of their financial products. However, this was part of their mission to train these folks and put them under quality control of other experienced preparers. In time, some of the "green" trainees who stuck around, became excellent tax preparers.

                      Block is a "for profit" corporation, and has an interesting and admirable history dating back to the 1954 code, almost by accident, and two brothers who laid a reputable foundation for growth.

                      Although I consider myself quite experienced by comparison, an interesting article appeared in March's NATP monthly, which measured success by the CUSTOMER's evaluation and what THEY want, rather than my own opinion. I concluded in the seven areas which were discussed as meeting the perceived needs of the client, HRB exceeded my combined resources/ability in five of those seven areas.

                      Thank you again, gkaiseril

                      Comment


                        #12
                        And Henry Block is still involved in the organization and is stressing customer satisfaction and quality preparation as the goals of the organization. You should start to see many changes that include the closing of some company offices. The in house mortgage and financial advisers have been sold off. It appears senior management realizes H&R Block's future is in providing professional tax preparation services and not retailing financial services.

                        H&R Block has established the Tax Institute at H&R Block that is available to H&R Block prepares, NAEA members, and subscribers to the TaxWorks program. Last year they even had the TaxBook in their offices and an employee discount program. And it is quite a good research source. Not only does it provide a concise answer but also provides citations to publications, code and other publications. Small firms can not provide this type of service.

                        And H&R Block has a significant presence in the Public Accounting industry with the ownership of RMS McGladry.

                        Their success or failure will depend upon how well district managers and franchise owners stress quality work and not just production of the bank products. And yes, one needs to be very careful at selecting their preparer as the skill levels and ability can very greatly within an office.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by gkaiseril View Post
                          H&R Block has established the Tax Institute at H&R Block that is available to H&R Block prepares, NAEA members, and subscribers to the TaxWorks program.
                          I just wanted to get a clarification. Are you saying that any member of NAEA can use the resources of the Tax Institute at HRB? If that is correct, I would be interested in learning how to access that.

                          I had thought that was reserved for HRB people only.

                          Thanks for this extremely interesting information.
                          Lennox C. (Len) Boush, EA, FNTPI
                          Heritage Income Tax Service, Inc.
                          Portsmouth, VA

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Tax Institute registeration site

                            The Tax Institute at H&R Block is a trusted resource for tax professionals. Find insights and media updates from expert tax research analysts.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Naea

                              On the NAEA web site, click on Tax Research Service on the right near the top.

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