Irs Meeting

[SueBaby]

Has anyone got a call from the IRS to have a meeting with you to talk over the mistakes they are seeing in a return yet? My meeting is this Friday at 10.

[Koss]

IRS Meeting

I haven't gotten the call or the letter...

I'm sure everyone in this community is anxious to hear how it goes for you.

I really don't think that they are reviewing specific, individual tax returns that you prepared. Rather, I think they are "profiling" certain preparers based on statistical data about the types of returns they prepare (for example, Schedule C with no expenses, with income at the peak of the EIC curve).

Your meeting is likely to be a generalized discussion of the most common mistakes that the IRS discovers on the types of returns that you often prepare. I would be very surprised if these meetings are focusing on specific returns. Unless the return was selected for an audit, or changed in some other way (e.g., math error authority, Notice CP-2000, etc.), how would the IRS know whether you actually made mistakes on any specific returns?

BMK

[SueBaby]

I haven't gotten the call or the letter...

I'm sure everyone in this community is anxious to hear how it goes for you.

I really don't think that they are reviewing specific, individual tax returns that you prepared. Rather, I think they are "profiling" certain preparers based on statistical data about the types of returns they prepare (for example, Schedule C with no expenses, with income at the peak of the EIC curve).

Your meeting is likely to be a generalized discussion of the most common mistakes that the IRS discovers on the types of returns that you often prepare. I would be very surprised if these meetings are focusing on specific returns. Unless the return was selected for an audit, or changed in some other way (e.g., math error authority, Notice CP-2000, etc.), how would the IRS know whether you actually made mistakes on any specific returns?

BMK

She said my name was picked from the computer to come and talk to me about returns that mainly preparers make mistakes on. Like Sch Cs and Sch Fs and other forms. It is not only me but others too. My turn seem to be Friday.

[BP.]

Has anyone got a call from the IRS to have a meeting

Phone call??

Inexcrupulous identity thieves have proven wily & sophisticated in exploiting IRS initiatives. Remember those phishing emails with the official blue IRS banner?

When a telephone call (as opposed to a letter, which hopefully will contain contact info) comes in from someone from IRS wanting to come into your office, what can/should we do to confirm identity? The comments here seem to indicate no specific client files will be reviewed, but we don't know yet, until we get feedback. How can we be sure we are providing access to client files to authorized parties?

Good luck, SueBaby. Please keep us posted.

Oh, PS- Here's where BHoffman cues up a little Ozzy for us! (A little Paranoid anyone?)
Barbara

[Koss]

Photo ID

Any real IRS employee will show you an IRS-issued photo ID card upon request. Many IRS employees wear this ID card around their neck. Most IRS employees will give you their business card when they meet you for the first time.

Yes, business cards are easy to forge. IRS photo ID cards are not. I haven't seen one for a while, but they have some sort of a seal and hologram, just like any recently issued driver's license.

If you have any doubts, the IRS employee should not be the least bit offended if you ask if you can call his/her office to verify their identity.

In a sophisticated scam, they would have someone waiting to answer the call, and they would give you a cell phone number. If you are really suspicious, you just have to start doing your own detective work. Ask whoever answers the phone for their address and job title. Ask for their employee number. If they can't give it to you in a heartbeat, something's wrong. If their employee number isn't ten digits, something's wrong.

Most, but not all, IRS business cards will have an office phone number and a fax number, and the two numbers should start with the same prefix. If you are suspicious that the business card may be fake, call the fax number, and see if a fax machine actually answers.

With very few exceptions, most IRS employees have their e-mail address on their business cards. At the risk of stating the obvious, the e-mail address always ends in irs.gov.

Listen carefully to how the IRS employee identifies himself/herself. Most agents do not say "IRS agent" or "federal agent." Although it is not unlawful for them to use these terms, that's just not how most of them talk. The culture of the IRS is such that they prefer more professional, technical job titles. Agents are discouraged from using language that characterizes them as gun-toting federal agents with a glorified, Hollywood-type image. What you are likely to hear are formal job titles such as revenue agent, revenue officer, and tax compliance officer. Some revenue agents may refer to themselves as a field agent.

In general, they cannot ask you to produce client returns or data unless they present a subpoena or a summons. There are a few important exceptions to this rule. For example, in a general e-file compliance review, they may have the authority to look at your signed Forms 8879... but I would have to look that up. I'm not sure.

If you are at all suspicious of the identity of someone claiming to be an IRS employee, do not be fooled, and do not be intimidated, by a law enforcement-style shield or badge. If anything, someone who "flashes their badge" at you should raise your suspicion level.

Some IRS agents do in fact carry a metal "enforcement shield." But IRS guidelines call for the shield to be presented in a leather case, together with photo ID. Any IRS agent that presents his or her shield in the context of a business meeting should give you plenty of time to closely inspect it and read the photo ID card that is in the case with it. In the context of a business meeting, "flashing" a badge by quickly opening and closing the case is extremely unprofessional, and may well be a badge of fraud (pun intended).

Finally: Very few IRS agents carry weapons. For the most part, the agents who carry weapons are in the Criminal Investigation Division. In general, they don't handle routine audits, and they don't do ERO compliance checks or EIC audits of tax pros. Criminal investigators are expensive, precious resources that are usually allocated to other priorities.

If someone claiming to be an IRS agent casually opens their coat or jacket to reveal that they are carrying a sidearm, you can quickly narrow the situation down to one of two possibilities:

(a) The guy is a real IRS agent, and you or your client should immediately get a lawyer, because one of you is probably the subject of a criminal investigation, OR

(b) The guy is a fraud, but the gun is probably real, and you might want to try to excuse yourself to the back room and call the police. If the local police show up and the guy turns out to be a real agent, he should not be offended, and he should interact professionally with the police.

Federal agents and other plain-clothes law enforcement officers who carry weapons are trained to avoid carelessly or casually exposing their weapon, because it makes people uncomfortable. Again, at the risk of stating the obvious, showing off a gun is not a good sign, and it doesn't prove the person is an IRS agent.

BMK

[BP.]

Thank-you, Burton. That's a print-and-keep. You referred to your posts as "your 2 cents," but when I plug a Koss-2-cents into my currency converter, it's worth a bit more than many 2 cent pieces around!

[SueBaby]

Any real IRS employee will show you an IRS-issued photo ID card upon request. Many IRS employees wear this ID card around their neck. Most IRS employees will give you their business card when they meet you for the first time.

Yes, business cards are easy to forge. IRS photo ID cards are not. I haven't seen one for a while, but they have some sort of a seal and hologram, just like any recently issued driver's license.

If you have any doubts, the IRS employee should not be the least bit offended if you ask if you can call his/her office to verify their identity.

In a sophisticated scam, they would have some waiting to answer the call, and they would give you a cell phone number. If you are really suspicious, you just have to start doing your own detective work. Ask whoever answers the phone for their address and job title. Ask for their employee number. If they can't give it to you in a heartbeat, something's wrong. If their employee number isn't ten digits, something's wrong.

Most, but not all, IRS business cards will have an office phone number and a fax number, and the two numbers should start with the same prefix. If you are suspicious that the business card may be fake, call the fax number, and see if a fax machine actually answers.

With very few exceptions, most IRS employees have their e-mail address on their business cards. At the risk of stating the obvious, the e-mail address always ends in irs.gov.

Listen carefully to how the IRS employee identifies himself/herself. Most agents do not say "IRS agent" or "federal agent." Although it is not unlawful for them to use these terms, that's just not how most of them talk. The culture of the IRS is such that they prefer more professional, technical job titles. Agents are discouraged from using language that characterizes them as gun-toting federal agents with a glorified, Hollywood-type image. What you are likely to hear are formal job titles such as revenue agent, revenue officer, and tax compliance officer. Some revenue agents may refer to themselves as a field agent.

In general, they cannot ask you to produce client returns or data unless they present a subpoena or a summons. There are fa ew important exceptions to this rule. For example, in a general e-file compliance review, they may have the authority to look at your signed Forms 8879... but I would have to look that up. I'm not sure.

If you are at all suspicious of the identity of someone claiming to be an IRS employee, do not be fooled, and do not be intimidated, by a law enforcement-style shield or badge. If anything, someone who "flashes their badge" at you should raise your suspicion level.

Some IRS agents do in fact carry a metal "enforcement shield." But IRS guidelines call for the shield to be presented in a leather case, together with photo ID. Any IRS agent that presents his or her shield in the context of a business meeting should give you plenty of time to closely inspect it and read the photo ID card that is in the case with it. In the context of a business meeting, "flashing" a badge by quickly opening and closing the case is extremely unprofessional, and may well be badge of fraud (pun intended).

Finally: Very few IRS agents carry weapons. For the most part, the agents who carry weapons are in the Criminal Investigation Division. In general, they don't handle routine audits, and they don't do ERO compliance checks or EIC audits of tax pros. Criminal investigators are expensive, precious resources that are usually allocated to other priorities.

If someone claiming to be an IRS agent casually opens their coat or jacket to reveal that they are carrying a sidearm, you can quickly narrow the situation down to one of two possibilities:

(a) The guy is a real IRS agent, and you or your client should immediately get a lawyer, because one of you is probably the subject of a criminal investigation, OR

(b) The guy is a fraud, but the gun is probably real, and you might want to try to excuse yourself to the back room and call the police. If the local police show up and the guy turns out to be a real agent, he should not be offended, and he should interact professionally with the police.

Federal agents and other plain-clothes law enforcement officers who carry weapons are trained to avoid carelessly or casually exposing their weapon, because it makes people uncomfortable. Again, at the risk of stating the obvious, showing off a gun is not a good sign, and it doesn't prove the person is an IRS agent.

BMK

Wow!!! I really have a good day to look forward to tomorrow. Let you all know how it turned out.

[BHoffman]

Here's for you, Suebaby

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyYZUhSeRYc

[joanmcq]

Part of Preparer Review.

Per the IRS website on new preparer registration

"First Step: Letters to 10,000 Preparers

The initiatives announced today will take several years to fully implement and will not be in effect for the current 2010 tax season. In the meantime, the IRS is taking immediate action to step up oversight of preparers for the 2010 filing season.

Beginning this week, the IRS is sending letters to approximately 10,000 paid tax return preparers nationwide. These preparers are among those with large volumes of specific tax returns where the IRS typically sees frequent errors. The letters are intended to remind preparers to be vigilant in areas where the errors are frequently found, including Schedule C income and expenses, Schedule A deductions, the Earned Income Tax Credit and the First Time Homebuyer Credit.

Thousands of the preparers who receive these letters will also be visited by IRS Revenue Agents in the coming weeks to discuss their obligations and responsibilities to prepare accurate tax returns. This is part of a broader initiative by the IRS to step up its efforts to ensure paid tax return preparers are assisting clients appropriately. Separately, the IRS will be conducting other compliance and education visits with return preparers on a variety of issues.

In addition, the IRS will more widely use investigative tools during this filing season aimed at determining tax return preparer non-compliance. One of those tools will include visits to return preparers by IRS agents posing as a taxpayer.

During this effort, the IRS will continue to work closely with the Department of Justice to pursue civil or criminal action as appropriate."

Sounds like you got caught in this net & are going to get educated.

[Larmil]

Per the IRS website on new preparer registration

"First Step: Letters to 10,000 Preparers

The initiatives announced today will take several years to fully implement and will not be in effect for the current 2010 tax season. In the meantime, the IRS is taking immediate action to step up oversight of preparers for the 2010 filing season.

Beginning this week, the IRS is sending letters to approximately 10,000 paid tax return preparers nationwide. These preparers are among those with large volumes of specific tax returns where the IRS typically sees frequent errors. The letters are intended to remind preparers to be vigilant in areas where the errors are frequently found, including Schedule C income and expenses, Schedule A deductions, the Earned Income Tax Credit and the First Time Homebuyer Credit.

Thousands of the preparers who receive these letters will also be visited by IRS Revenue Agents in the coming weeks to discuss their obligations and responsibilities to prepare accurate tax returns. This is part of a broader initiative by the IRS to step up its efforts to ensure paid tax return preparers are assisting clients appropriately. Separately, the IRS will be conducting other compliance and education visits with return preparers on a variety of issues.

In addition, the IRS will more widely use investigative tools during this filing season aimed at determining tax return preparer non-compliance. One of those tools will include visits to return preparers by IRS agents posing as a taxpayer.

During this effort, the IRS will continue to work closely with the Department of Justice to pursue civil or criminal action as appropriate."

Sounds like you got caught in this net & are going to get educated.

You mention letters and and visits. That is nothing new (unless the visits are in a vehicle that don't have government license plates). But, CALLS are new to me.

[S T]

Letter or Call

SueBaby

Did you receive a call or a letter?

I would be suspect of a phone call? How can you identify the caller

Based on what is posted -seems like you should have received a notice letter.

But then what do I know - this whole procedure is new to all of us.

Sandy

PS I love B Hoffman's post and Bob Marly - that made my day today

[Koss]

Bandwidth

Brad and the team over at TTB oughta consider increasing the bandwidth capacity of this site tomorrow afternoon...

I think by 1:00 PM or so, every regular participant on this board will be logged in, checking for an update from SueBaby to see how that meeting with the IRS went.



SueBaby, if we don't hear from you by 2:00 tomorrow, we might just have to do for you what Warren Zevon asked his dad to do, in what may be his finest, and most underrated ballad:

"Send lawyers, guns and money!"



BMK

[Jesse]

Mlinder if your out there....

One of my preparers received a letter.The IRS agent wanted to come to her house to see the returns after many phone calls he finally realized that they were not there.She did not do returns at home only for me .He wanted her to be present at the time of the audit she works a good day job does returns for me nights and Saturday.During peak she is there every night mostly appointments she makes.He is coming tomorrow @ 10:00 am. I tried to explain to him to come after peak but he would not.He asked for a desk and a phone I told him we have no desks we are a liquor store and I would give him a table and a chair no phone we only use cell phones for the tax office and only have one line for the liquor store and one phone.I said I will pull the 125 returns he wants out the the storage boxes for him .We did over 2300 returns with 80% EIC. I thought they would come but the letter would be to the efin holder not the individual preparers.I don't know what he would have done if she no longer worked for me this season.Will update Monday night if I don't end up in jail or the hospital with a heart attack.I know all the returns are OK we lose at least 100 returns a year we refuse to do.

How did your meeting go?

[Black Bart]

On the other hand,

Per the IRS website... the IRS is taking immediate action to step up oversight of preparers for the 2010 filing season. Beginning this week, the IRS is sending letters to approximately 10,000 paid tax return preparers nationwide...

Thousands of the preparers who receive these letters will also be visited by IRS Revenue Agents in the coming weeks...investigative tools...will include visits to return preparers by IRS agents posing as a taxpayer.

maybe they're not "visiting thousands," but instead just doing a large-scale, widely-publicized, low-cost PR letter campaign (including a few token visits) to scare us up (it's working). See jimmcg's reply below to Bob W's thread question ("Irs Visit Letter????") of 1-24-10:

1-24-10 Originally Posted by BOB W
Has anyone had an IRS visit yet?

1-24-2010, 05:38 PM
jimmcg
Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Vulcan
Posts: 403

Spoke with a friend at the Cincinnatti district office and they are assigning very few to this project, mostly to high volume EIC storefront operations. As Willie Sutton once said "you go where the easy money is."

[nwtaxlady]

Good Info !!

Kuddos to Burton Koss. VERY GOOD information you provided to all of us. You gave some EXCELLENT pointers!

THANK YOU!

And can't wait to hear about the visit!