Speaking fees

[DTS]

Client has a very small amount of misc. income, half of which is for an occassional speaking engagement at a couple organizations like a non-profit and church.

Are the speaking fees subject to SE tax?

Thank you,

D

[kaimana]

If this is an ongoing gig, even occasionally, and he gets paid, I would say yes.

[Gretel]

I think so too.

[newbie]

Call Geitner wasn't that part of his troubles - JK

If a profit motive and done on a regular basis I say speaking fees subject to SE tax.

[BHoffman]

DTS - is the taxpayer actively engaged in the business of public speaking? Does he advertise and spend some measure of time and money to obtain engagements?

I don't think one or even three small engagements per year necessarily makes this a business.

[DTS]

Fees

OK, what do all of you consider "regular or ongoing"?

This occured a couple times a year. Not trying to be a smarty-pants, but I'm quite sure there is not even a profit motive here.

Regular and/or ongoing. I guess I'll check on this.

D

[DTS]

DTS - is the taxpayer actively engaged in the business of public speaking? Does he advertise and spend some measure of time and money to obtain engagements?

I don't think one or even three small engagements per year necessarily makes this a business.

B,

This is exactly the point with my fellow. He is not actively engaged in this, does not solicit anyone to speak (he wrote a popular book some years ago) and is asked to appear once or twice a year. His regular business is that of successful contracting, not writing or speaking.

I suppose if I were contacted to give a talk, paid of course, on mowing lawns, I'd have to pay SE on this.

D

[newbie]

Client has a very small amount of misc. income, half of which is for an occassional speaking engagement at a couple organizations like a non-profit and church.

Are the speaking fees subject to SE tax?

Thank you,

D

What is the other half of misc income from? What does he speak about - something in is line of work? Probably a lot more questions and answers needed to determine.

[BHoffman]

DTS - be brave

From how you are describing this, I really don't think you think this rises to the level of a bona fide business operation.

Now, what if the Sch C results in a loss?

[DTS]

Finding my happy place!

From how you are describing this, I really don't think you think this rises to the level of a bona fide business operation.

Now, what if the Sch C results in a loss?

If put on a C with expenses, no SE. Geez, this sounds kinda basic

[Gretel]

Interesting - I guess we could consider all activities not entered into for profit a line 21 income. Isn't this what the IRS says? No profit motive - no biz - therefor no Sch. C? I don't know if there is any consideration with hobby income about continuous and regular activities. The IRS probably will try to classify as biz if gain and as hobby if loss but they cannot have it both ways.

Knowing a little more about the situation I would claim income on line 21, expenses might be lost.

[DTS]

What is the other half of misc income from? What does he speak about - something in is line of work? Probably a lot more questions and answers needed to determine.

Newbie,

Not sure what the other smaller amounts are for. They amount to a little more than $300. This showed up on deposits as misc, without any knowledge of what they were for. The speaking fees were labeled by the payor orgs.

D

[tacks]

...Now, what if the Sch C results in a loss?

If put on a C with expenses, no SE. Geez, this sounds kinda basic

Those are the exact thoughts which entered my mind. Thanks for posting.

[erchess]

My Two Cents

So the client has roughly $300 in public speaking income and a bit more than that in public speaking expenses and roughly $300 in income that he doesn't know what it is for. And the taxpayer is a relatively well off individual and certainly not in the lowest tax bracket. Is that about it?

I think I would take the position that the money we are arguing about is too small to be worth arguing about. Put the entire amount on a Sch C and subject the profit to both income and SE tax.

Keep in mind he has the right to make the bank tell him who the mystery money is from. That might be useful if you are determined to get everything perfect.

[Jesse]

I may get beat for this but...........

if it's only $300 what's the difference if it's line 21 or Schedule C-EZ?