NEW submission ID for Efiling-DCN OBSOLETE

[Bees Knees]

ProSeries does not print the SID on the 8879 or the 9325, but you can print it out on a separate sheet after the return is accepted. Go to the accepted e-filed returns listed from the e-file home page, scroll to the right, and you will see in one of the columns the SID for both the federal and the state.

I have been printing those out and keeping them with the 8879 if IRS ever comes asking for them. I do not give it to the client unless the client asks for it (I give the client the 9325 which does not contain the SID).

[David1980]

Based on actual returns for this year, the SID remains as originally generated/printed even though it does not correspond to the date actually transmitted. Returns have been (federally) accepted and subsequently submitted to state.

It does appear California at least rejects the returns if the Julian date portion of the submission ID is more than two days prior to the actual processing date. So if filing California returns, you wouldn't want to generate the submission ID more than a couple days prior to efiling.

[S T]

Thanks Taxxcpa for the info on Drake - being new to Drake - I was not sure how to obtain the SID info, however it is on my ACKS, and I do keep those for each client file PDF.

The report you describe would be good as well!

Sandy

[JON]

I understand better now!!

The local IRS liason officer explained it this way. Depending on your software you have to be able to show the submission number assigned to the return. She said if you can get a print out at the end of the year that shows the taxpayer and the number just retain that for the three years, unless you want to record it on all of the 8879s that is an alternative. She also said that the number is created everytime you compute the E file. So if you change numbers on the return and recompute the E file it will change the number.

I think I can get the ACKs with the submission number at the end of the year. I do not know if you have to print it, but I may do that. I was wondering why there was a number on the 8879s. I guess I am still wondering.. Per the liason DCNs were always a legacy feature, even last year and now they are not anything..

[taxxcpa]

Sid

Using Drake, the DCN appears on both the 8879 and the 9325. You can go to the EF data base and look them up one at a time, but there is an easier way. You can go to Reports and create a report under EF and Bank Products. The report can include the client name, Federal SID and State SID. The report can be exported to Excel, and at the end of the tax season or any time in between, you can print the Excel worksheet.

Unless a client asks for the SID, it is not too likely that you will actually need this, but to be on the safe side, I'll print the report after tax season and keep it for a few years.

Hopefully all software companies will provide some means of doing this.

[DonPriebe]

... I wonder what would happen with TaxWise if you created the efile and then do the transmission the next day instead of right away. Or if you produce the e-file and have the taxpayer come in a few days later to sign. The Julian date in the submission ID would be wrong for the date transmitted. Doesn't look like the IRS is doing any validation against that though so it probably is fine. The only thing it really needs is to be globally unique which if the submission ID is created upon efile creation should be fine.

Based on actual returns for this year, the SID remains as originally generated/printed even though it does not correspond to the date actually transmitted. Returns have been (federally) accepted and subsequently submitted to state.

[David1980]

MeF has never used DCN 's.

Well, the DCN format, if DCN's were used, would still be the same as prior years. It'd be easy enough to generate and print a DCN, the number would just be meaningless. Could be they just don't want to deal with preparer's asking "Where's the DCN?" and choose to continue printing a non-used DCN. I've seen stranger things. As long as the submission ID is available somewhere I don't see the point in having it on an 8879 vs somewhere else. Just have it somewhere associated with the acked returns and who is going to really care that it isn't on the 8879 form itself? MEF itself isn't new after all and it's never been on the 8879 in prior years.

[S T]

I am showing 2 different numbers on my ACKS - I have a submission ID - not being printed on the Form 8879 and I have a DCN which is bing printed on the Form 8879 for signature

Just going with the info that the original post started out as - I can not reprint a 8879 with SID - only shows the DCN

So guess if I print the ACK with the SID and have a note on that - I am meeting the requirements?

Sandy

[appelman]

Where is it getting a DCN?

Through my software when I process the t/p return, and print out the 8879 forms for signature - it is printing out a DCN

Do I need to do more? confused by the prior posts.

Nothing seems any different than what I have done in the past years. I do know if a rejection or changes - I have to reprint and obtain new signatures.

Sandy

MeF has never used DCN 's.

[appelman]

Au contraire!

Not necessarily. Depends on your software. Based on last year's MeF submissions ...

TaxWise assigns the Submission ID when the e-file is created, so it appears on any 8879 printed after that time. So if you follow the normal sequence (prepare return, run diagnostics, produce e-file, print return, review with client, have client sign, transmit return ... ) you have a signed 8879 with the correct number on it. If you make any changes and/or rerun the diagnostics, you have to remake the e-file, and the SID changes.

On the other extreme, TaxAct created the SID when they transmitted to the IRS, and the SID never appeared anywhere (i.e. was not on the acknowledgement).

My TaxAct acks always give SID's, which I retain electronically. If anyone isn't satisfied with that, they can hang me for it!

[S T]

I probably have to call my software, one return efiled, the original 8879 that was given for signature of T/p only has the DCN

Return efiled, and ACK's retrieved for same

Go back to the return - no new notation on the 8879 for the Submission ID #, however I do have it on my ACK

There is no way I can print an updated 8879 with the SID info, unless my software provides it

Is the ACK printout enough?

Sandy

[David1980]

Through my software when I process the t/p return, and print out the 8879 forms for signature - it is printing out a DCN

Do I need to do more? confused by the prior posts.

Nothing seems any different than what I have done in the past years. I do know if a rejection or changes - I have to reprint and obtain new signatures.

Sandy

You may be - the 8879 no longer has "DCN" - that was replaced with "Submission Identification Number (SID)" http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f8879.pdf

Format of a submission ID is different than a DCN, but it's mostly equivalent to DCN.

The format of a submission ID is globally unique 20 digit number with the following format: (EFIN + ccyyddd + 7-digit alphanumeric sequence number)

Not necessarily. Depends on your software. Based on last year's MeF submissions ...

TaxWise assigns the Submission ID when the e-file is created, so it appears on any 8879 printed after that time. So if you follow the normal sequence (prepare return, run diagnostics, produce e-file, print return, review with client, have client sign, transmit return ... ) you have a signed 8879 with the correct number on it. If you make any changes and/or rerun the diagnostics, you have to remake the e-file, and the SID changes.

On the other extreme, TaxAct created the SID when they transmitted to the IRS, and the SID never appeared anywhere (i.e. was not on the acknowledgement).

That makes sense. I wonder what would happen with TaxWise if you created the efile and then do the transmission the next day instead of right away. Or if you produce the e-file and have the taxpayer come in a few days later to sign. The Julian date in the submission ID would be wrong for the date transmitted. Doesn't look like the IRS is doing any validation against that though so it probably is fine. The only thing it really needs is to be globally unique which if the submission ID is created upon efile creation should be fine.

[S T]

Through my software when I process the t/p return, and print out the 8879 forms for signature - it is printing out a DCN

Do I need to do more? confused by the prior posts.

Nothing seems any different than what I have done in the past years. I do know if a rejection or changes - I have to reprint and obtain new signatures.

Sandy

[DonPriebe]

I'm not sure the point in that. I do know the submission ID isn't assigned until the return is transmitted.

Not necessarily. Depends on your software. Based on last year's MeF submissions ...

TaxWise assigns the Submission ID when the e-file is created, so it appears on any 8879 printed after that time. So if you follow the normal sequence (prepare return, run diagnostics, produce e-file, print return, review with client, have client sign, transmit return ... ) you have a signed 8879 with the correct number on it. If you make any changes and/or rerun the diagnostics, you have to remake the e-file, and the SID changes.

On the other extreme, TaxAct created the SID when they transmitted to the IRS, and the SID never appeared anywhere (i.e. was not on the acknowledgement).

[David1980]

I'm not sure the point in that. I do know the submission ID isn't assigned until the return is transmitted. I also know the submission ID is different on different submissions. If the return gets rejected, or if you send the fed and then send the state separately, you'll have multiple submissions and thus multiple submission IDs.

What I don't understand is why I'd be required to print an 8879 to attach to the original one w/out submission ID after the return is acknowledged. The submission ID would exist in the tax software if I ever needed it, wouldn't it? Seems like I could access the submission IDs at any time I need to. Where as with keeping signed copies of 8879 you can't do that later - you do that when the taxpayer is there to sign prior to efile. Obviously the submission ID will be blank when the taxpayer signs as you can't transmit without the signatures.