New deductions!

[JG EA]

It is always amazing to me how TP's don't feel responsible for their numbers because they went to a preparer. I always feel they know and think that they are getting away with something. But many times they think: I took the information in and gave it to the preparer, it was done correctly because they are the professional, and my what a good job they did.

I got a question about this very scenario by someone for whom I don't do their taxes. Their new preparer found where their old preparer had not included much of their SE income. They were horrified and called me to see what recourse they had with the old preparer.I explained that many times they do cover penalty, but not the taxes. The old one could say they didn't get the information. But the point is the client didn't know. And they want to amend and pay back their refund.

We are so attuned to the nuances on a tax return - or just the plain bold numbers staring us in the face - that it surprises us when people don't really know.

So, I agree that you would be doing them a favor to explain what is going on with their tax return. The rest is up to them.

I used to think that educating clients is a mistake, because then they can do it themselves. Now I think it increases their respect for our job.

[Possi]

I will do that

I sure hope you feel you can talk to this person. Ask him where the figures came from. You will be doing him a favor if you point out this stuff to him and let him see what a mess that is.

I have a new client this year who had the same man (older spanish man) doing their taxes for about 20 years. He has been going downhill healthwise lately. His daughter was supposedly helping him. He seemed very thorough and she did not check his figures on the return. He never went over the return with them.

They got audited by IRS for 2006,2007, and 2008 returns and they owe BIG money. They got a tax attorney and are making payments.

Point is they didn't know what he was putting on the tax return. They trusted him. She is a friend of mine and her sister in law came to me this year too. I told her I go over the return with the client and tell them what is on the return. If they see something that should be on there and isn't,we can correct it. Or if some thing on there that shouldn't be, we will fix it.

So talk to him. Show him what that person put on his return. And if he signs it and sends it in, he is saying that those figures are correct and he can back them up.

He may love you forever if you save him from trouble down the road.

I didn't talk to him last night. It was late when I got the return, his wife dropped it off, and I sent him a text saying he could call anytime. I'm glad he didn't call last night because I really was distraught. I'm in a much better frame of mind after discussing this over the water-cooler with everyone.

Thanks for the level-headed advise. I will talk to him and I'll let you know how it turns out.

[oceanlovin'ea]

talk to him

I sure hope you feel you can talk to this person. Ask him where the figures came from. You will be doing him a favor if you point out this stuff to him and let him see what a mess that is.

I have a new client this year who had the same man (older spanish man) doing their taxes for about 20 years. He has been going downhill healthwise lately. His daughter was supposedly helping him. He seemed very thorough and she did not check his figures on the return. He never went over the return with them.

They got audited by IRS for 2006,2007, and 2008 returns and they owe BIG money. They got a tax attorney and are making payments.

Point is they didn't know what he was putting on the tax return. They trusted him. She is a friend of mine and her sister in law came to me this year too. I told her I go over the return with the client and tell them what is on the return. If they see something that should be on there and isn't,we can correct it. Or if some thing on there that shouldn't be, we will fix it.

So talk to him. Show him what that person put on his return. And if he signs it and sends it in, he is saying that those figures are correct and he can back them up.

He may love you forever if you save him from trouble down the road.

[Possi]

More affirmations!

Is this "wonder preparer" going to represent him at the audit? This looks like a preparer project in the works. I remember well an audit of a few years back. The return had come from a preparer well known within a certain circle for producing huge refunds. However when the audit notice came they were suddenly unable to return a phone call.

The client came to me and I prepped for the audit throwing off a bunch of deductions in the pre-audit interview. When I'm sitting with the IRS agent he is looking over the "C" and asks me "You didn't prepare this did you?" Before I could answer he turned back to the second page and looking at the signature and exclaimed, "Oh my god, not that woman again?"

I do have a reputation for taking care of the police officers with the city my son works for, but not for cheating and getting fat refunds. I tell them that if one of my officers are audited and we lied, then (waving my hand toward my files) 400 of my best friends are under scrutiny.

I love that real life experience you shared. It affirms my honesty. thanks for sharing~

[DaveO]

Is this "wonder preparer" going to represent him at the audit? This looks like a preparer project in the works. I remember well an audit of a few years back. The return had come from a preparer well known within a certain circle for producing huge refunds. However when the audit notice came they were suddenly unable to return a phone call.

The client came to me and I prepped for the audit throwing off a bunch of deductions in the pre-audit interview. When I'm sitting with the IRS agent he is looking over the "C" and asks me "You didn't prepare this did you?" Before I could answer he turned back to the second page and looking at the signature and exclaimed, "Oh my god, not that woman again?"

[Possi]

omG

BCP=Blue Cross Plan?????

omGosh, you don't think they took his health insurance do you? Haven't talked to him to ask him all that yet...

I think it's for Bull Crap Pants so he'll be ready for the audit! Good think that tax preparer talks to the IRS agents every day so she knows that she can take all these deductions!

I'd have to do more than TALK to IRS agents to get away with that....

[WhiteOleander]

BCP=Blue Cross Plan?????

[Possi]

Are you ...

Possi - Any idiot can prepare a tax return that results in a refund. It takes a very special idiot to prepare one that is correct and complete.

...calling me "special??"

Oh thanks.... hahahaha

[BHoffman]

Possi - Any idiot can prepare a tax return that results in a refund. It takes a very special idiot to prepare one that is correct and complete.

[Possi]

Oh Thanks Y'all!

At my church, BCP is the Book of Common Prayer. With deductions like those, your policeman should do a lot of praying, but it's personal and not a business expense!

BCP! HAHAHAHAHA

I'll be sure to ask about that one!

Looking to more replies in the morning. I do feel better, and will always sleep well knowing I am the honest one.

When you look at the business name and see that they clearly wrote "1099 misc from XXX Church" and not even a BUSINESS, isn't that looking for trouble from the beginning?? I feel like my client was used and abused and is being set up for an audit. Idiots.

[Lion]

Bcp

At my church, BCP is the Book of Common Prayer. With deductions like those, your policeman should do a lot of praying, but it's personal and not a business expense!

[FEDUKE404]

Looking for an audit.....

Well, at least I've now had my evening laugh....

Here are questions I would like to ask:

1 - Business travel is from where to where? Total/personal/commuting/business with log. Good chance there is little legit "business" travel, for Sch C or Form 2106. Especially if he uses police car for employee work and a personal car for Sch C (it's called commuting).
2 - Repairs and maintenance to what??
3 - Depreciation of what? ("show me the schedule!") My $ is on a computer and related!
4 - Service ammo and such for training is usually provided by employer. Does he use special "church ammo" and/or a "church firearm" ??
5 - And exactly how much church time does he spend on the cell phone?
6 - Toner and paper - exactly why does he need that as either employee or self-employed?
7 - I have no idea what BCP is, but for $3200 think I'd ask!
8- I'm sure medical expenses are mostly pre-tax insurance and/or bills partially paid via cafeteria plan. I would ask questions and then take a serious look at the W2 and then even ask for a year-end pay summary. "But I PAID them!" is probable response....

Well, at least there is no current donut deduction......does he have a Facebook page (deduct those ISP charges!)

This guy is screaming for an audit, as is the preparer if he treats all his police buddies the same way.

Did this officer ever have a job with Amway?

Oh yes - remind me not to visit that church!!

FE

[Gretel]

Thank you, Possi. You know you are not wrong, but others don't. You mentioned that this guy is actually a friend of some sort? So, you can talk to him reasonably? Looks to me like a fraudulent return with paper and toner (maybe preparer meant toilet paper for s... pants because afraid of assault or gun men or whatever...).

Anyway, if this client wants peace of mind he probably listens to you?

[BP.]

Oh gosh, possi. Speechless. Your comments are funny, but I know this does not have you laughing. Thanks for the time it took to put your post together for us. Why would you even think you are wrong? You are the one that can sleep at night knowing you'd never put something like this together.
Peace, Barbara

[Possi]

It's In!

The police officer's return was just dropped off to me.

Now, he is a police officer and typically, police officers do extra work as security. When this happens, I know they drive to the destination and they sit and watch. Sometimes they have trouble and arrest someone. My son was in an altercation and was almost gang mauled one night at his gig...

Anyway, he got a 1099 from a church. FROM A CHURCH, OK?

The Sch C business is "1099 from XYZ CHURCH" THAT IS THE BUSINESS NAME.

Are you ready??

Income 17500

Business miles is 15,600 for a vehicle deduction of 8580. (He drives there and sits, remember) "Do you have evidence to support your deduction?" yes "If "Yes," is the evidence written?" NO

Depreciation 3800 (NO depreciation schedule and no 4562)

Legal and professional service (my DISCOUNTED FEE of ONLY 75)

Repairs and Maintenance 4680 (What? What broke? His @$$?)

Cell phone 2160 (I take a percent of business use)

Uniforms Boots Drycleanin (their spelling) 1250 (I do take $8 a week to launder uniforms, I confess)

Range Amu (their spelling) 300

BCP (what IS that?) 3180

Toner and paper 310

He sits in a church parking lot and walks people to their cars!

His police wages were about 51,000.

I know a percentage of his employee expenses can go toward the Sch C, but there is NO 2106. It's all on the Sch C and it's all trumped up.

They also had medical expenses of $8100. I am sure they took insurance that is paid in pre-tax dollars.

I just want to throw up. If he tells people he got back TRIPLE THE REFUND by going someplace else, I could lose a lot of business with people thinking I'm an idiot.

So there it is. What do you think?

In a stretch, I know I could have taken 25% of regular police expenses on the Sch C, but never no never trumped up expenses like those. I think it screams "audit me"...

... but I could be wrong.....

Thanks for letting me vent. It's so hard when you work alone and this stuff happens.